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Battle of Tumhalad

2014-10-08T20:58:32Z

Corgatha: added a space

{{battle
| image=
| name=Battle of Tumhalad
| conflict=[[Wars of Beleriand]]
|date={{FA|495}}<ref>{{GA|275}}</ref>
| place=[[Tumhalad]]
| result=Victory for [[Morgoth]]
| side1=The [[Elves of Nargothrond]]
| side2=Forces of Morgoth
| commanders1=*[[Túrin]]
*[[Orodreth]]
| commanders2=*Unnamed Orc captain
*[[Glaurung]]
| forces1=
| forces2=
| casual1=
| casual2=
}}
The '''Battle of Tumhalad''' was the last battle of the Elves of [[Nargothrond]]. It was fought on the plain of [[Tumhalad]] between the [[Narog]] and its tributary, the [[Ginglith]].

==Prelude==

The battle was fought as result of a massive [[Orcs|Orc]]-buildup beneath the [[Ered Wethrin|Mountains of Shadow]] and in the [[Pass of Sirion]]. Messengers from [[Círdan]] brought these tidings and a message from Círdan concerning a warning from the [[Valar|Vala]] [[Ulmo]] that the Elves of Nargothrond should not fight in open battles against the armies of [[Morgoth]].

However [[Túrin|Túrin Turambar]], a [[Men|Man]] and an influential commander of Nargothrond's forces, urged King [[Orodreth]] to venture out and fight the forces of Morgoth.

==The Battle==
The Elves of Nargothrond, though, were not used to open battle for they had always waged a guerilla war, ambushing but never assaulting the forces of Morgoth. Also, the evil hosts were larger than anticipated and led by the [[Dragons|Dragon]] [[Glaurung]].

The forces of Nargothrond could not withstand the assault and were driven towards the plain of Tumhalad, were most of them, including King Orodreth and the Elf-lord [[Gwindor]], were slain. Only Túrin withstood the attack of Glaurung, as he wore the [[Dwarves|Dwarven]]-crafted [[Dragon-helm of Dor-lómin]].

==Aftermath==
The defeat suffered by the Elves allowed the [[Sack of Nargothrond]] by Glaurung.

Elven casualties undoubtedly were very high, given that Nargothrond is totally erased with this defeat and unable to continue forth even in a weakened state, like how Doriath did after the [[ Battle of the Thousand Caves]]. The few survivors fled to Doriath, the [[Isle of Balar]] or possibly rallying to the futile defence of Nargothrond itself.

{{references}}

[[Category:Conflicts of the First Age]]
[[de:Schlacht von Tumhalad]]
[[fr:encyclo:evenements:1a:guerres:bataille_de_tumhalad]]

Battle of Tumhalad

2014-10-06T06:00:40Z

Corgatha: Axed the bit about the baseless numbers.

{{battle
| image=
| name=Battle of Tumhalad
| conflict=[[Wars of Beleriand]]
|date={{FA|495}}<ref>{{GA|275}}</ref>
| place=[[Tumhalad]]
| result=Victory for [[Morgoth]]
| side1=The [[Elves of Nargothrond]]
| side2=Forces of Morgoth
| commanders1=*[[Túrin]]
*[[Orodreth]]
| commanders2=*Unnamed Orc captain
*[[Glaurung]]
| forces1=
| forces2=
| casual1=
| casual2=
}}
The '''Battle of Tumhalad''' was the last battle of the Elves of [[Nargothrond]]. It was fought on the plain of [[Tumhalad]] between the [[Narog]] and its tributary, the [[Ginglith]].

==Prelude==

The battle was fought as result of a massive [[Orcs|Orc]]-buildup beneath the [[Ered Wethrin|Mountains of Shadow]] and in the [[Pass of Sirion]]. Messengers from [[Círdan]] brought these tidings and a message from Círdan concerning a warning from the [[Valar|Vala]] [[Ulmo]] that the Elves of Nargothrond should not fight in open battles against the armies of [[Morgoth]].

However [[Túrin|Túrin Turambar]], a [[Men|Man]] and an influential commander of Nargothrond's forces, urged King [[Orodreth]] to venture out and fight the forces of Morgoth.

==The Battle==
The Elves of Nargothrond, though, were not used to open battle for they had always waged a guerilla war, ambushing but never assaulting the forces of Morgoth. Also, the evil hosts were larger than anticipated and led by the [[Dragons|Dragon]] [[Glaurung]].

The forces of Nargothrond could not withstand the assault and were driven towards the plain of Tumhalad, were most of them, including King Orodreth and the Elf-lord [[Gwindor]], were slain. Only Túrin withstood the attack of Glaurung, as he wore the [[Dwarves|Dwarven]]-crafted [[Dragon-helm of Dor-lómin]].

==Aftermath==
The defeat suffered by the Elves allowed the [[Sack of Nargothrond]] by Glaurung.

Elven casualties undoubtedly were very high, given that Nargothrond is totally erased with this defeat and unable to continue forth even in a weakened state, like how Doriath did after the [[ Battle of the Thousand Caves]]. The few survivors fledto Doriath, the [[Isle of Balar]] or possibly rallying to the futile defence of Nargothrond itself.

{{references}}

[[Category:Conflicts of the First Age]]
[[de:Schlacht von Tumhalad]]
[[fr:encyclo:evenements:1a:guerres:bataille_de_tumhalad]]

Talk:Battle of Tumhalad

2014-09-29T17:24:52Z

Corgatha: Number of troops given in the battle is not only baseless, but likely more than the entire host of Fingolfin. It should be revised downwards, if not removed entirely.

As a new user, thought I should at least bring it up in discussion before making edits, but the "estimation" that Nargothrond had around 30,000 warriors is not only high, it's very likely higher than the number of Noldor warriors in all the first age. Personally, I think it should be removed.

My reasoning goes as follows. We know that Turgon has 10,000 warriors with him at Nirneath Arnoediad.(Chapter 20, Of the Fifth Battle. ) We also know that the "third part" I.e. 1/3 of the Noldor of Fingolfin's following went to settle in Gondolin (Chapter 15, Of the Noldor in Beleriand), and that furthermore, the Noldor were a minority, since there was "and a yet greater host of the Sindar".

Now, here's where I'm making 2 assumptions, but I think they're both good ones: Firstly, that Turgon would have sent most if not all of his forces to the fifth battle. Why wouldn't he? This is the big chance to beat Morgoth, as far as he knows, and besides, Gondolin is hidden and secure, and thus doesn't need a big garrison in case of surprise attack.

The second assumption is that the armed forces of Gondolin were more or less in line with the overall population. If the Noldor were a minority in the city, they'd also be a minority of the army. We don't see any reluctance of the Sindar to get stuck in, and there's no immediately clear reason why some of them wouldn't take up arms in service of their king. Even if that's not the case, being the ruling and tougher breed of Elf, you'd think it would be far more likely that Gondolin's army would be disproportionately Noldor, and not disproportionately Sindar.

But in any event, even if every single one of those 10,000 troops was a Noldor, that represents a third of Fingolfin's following, which means you can't really have more than 20,000 other Noldor troops to divide between Dorthonion, Hithlum, and Nargothrond, nevermind 30,000 in Nargothrond alone. And if a big chunk of Gondolin's army is Sindar, the number drops precipitously.

So can we axe the numbers? Or at least tone them down to something more reasonable, a few thousand troops for Nargothrond tops.