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User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/Narn i Chîn Húrin

2009-04-07T19:14:15Z

Maeglin: /* Gurthang speaking */

Well, this seems to be fairly unused, but I'd like to start working on this if anyone else would.
--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 12:05, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

== Gurthang speaking ==

On a minor note, is it entirely important to make Gurthang speak in the end where Turin dies? I think that could be construed as a little.... silly? I'm not quite sure, but it seems it would be better without. I certainly don't want to change the story, but it doesn't seem to insignificant to cut.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 19:35, 6 June 2008 (EDT)

:We could adjust the form of Gurthang's "speaking" to mental messages when his eye meets someone. I'm sure a good director could make something good out of it, but it does seem odd to have a great dragon talking like a man. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil]] 00:11, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

Good idea. However, just to clarify, I was refering to Gurthang (Anglachel), the sword, not Glaurung the Dragon.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 19:14, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

== Hurin in the Story ==

This for me is a rather confusing part of the story to deal with, as Hurin is a focal point but not in the tale very much. Generally I have a few ideas as well as a few things to think about:

I think Hurin should obviously be intertwined with the story. How? I have a few ideas but perhaps not clear enough.

I would like to see the 'movie' end as the book does, with Morwen dying at Turin's monument. It is an emotional part of the story and completes the tragedy for Hurin (ie; he has failed in life, been tortured, watched his children die in tragedy and now at the culmination of it all he has lost his wife.)

It would also be interesting to intertwine Hurin with visits to Thangorodrim showing how Hurin is taking this all, but I'm not sure how it would work. Is this a good idea?

Finally concerning Hurin, could he narrate the tale?

--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 12:05, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

:This is a tricky spot indeed. Hurin narrating might work, what about instead of ending with Morwen's death, throughout the story the narrator's voice goes from powerful and strong and slowly diminishes until the last scene in which he throws himself into the Great Sea in despair. I suppose it may weaken the impact if we have too many tragic deaths near the end of the film but not telling the end of Hurin and the end of the curse seems to do injustice. Intertwining Hurin into the middle of the story is a must as we can't just show him at the beginning and at the end, even if we only cut to him a few short times it'll improve the audience's connection with him. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 13:53, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

:I like that idea. Hurin's weakening voice would be great. I still think Hurin's finding Morwen bears great sentimental value to the story, so perhaps the 'narration' finishes after we see the final scene in the actual Narn where Turin commits sucicide. When that scene ends the narration is done and it blends to the same spot, but years later. The reuniting of Hurin and Morwen ensues and after her death we show Hurin's end. All his family is dead and the curse is complete. I agree the curse needs to be emphasized, but at the same time it can't be too mystical, so it can be agreeable to 'tolkien scholars' and regular people. Does that work?

I think the tragic deaths can be spaced out andstill have impact. I think Turin and Nienor flow fine without losing impact, and Morwen is portrayed as the last thing Hurin has, this culminates to his death. If shown right it should work.
--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 19:32, 6 June 2008 (EDT)

== Structure ==

Since this is a complex tale, especially because it is about Hurin, but focuses on the deeds of Turin. This presents opportuninty to make a more complex style of movie. Maybe this is Hurin watching it all, or perhaps it begins with Hurin wandering after he is released and is a series of flashbacks until he finds Morwen. Maybe Hurin is relating the story of what happened to their children to Morwen, who remembers who she is after wandering for all these years(Is that too much like 'The Notebook'? I haven't seen it but I heard something similar happens.). At any rate, does anyone have ideas? I think it is the perfect tale to do something a little 'different' with rather than just showing the story unfold.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 12:05, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

:I would rather prefer that the encounter of Húrin and Morwen be the climax or nearly so. Instead perhaps we could switch events around so that Húrin is telling his tale to, say, [[Thingol]]. He tells of his escape and how Morgoth placed him high and set him to watch the doom of his children. He wraps up the movie by his release and the death of Mîm. Then we return to where Húrin stands before Thingol and departs in anguish. At the very end of the film, Húrin finds Morwen. If the story of the Fall of Gondolin was made as a sort of sequel, we could also include Húrin's shouting at the mountains (otherwise it holds no meaning with the audience). --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil]] 00:11, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

I've been rather busy, but have been looking into this again lately... anyway, I think the story should focus on the children of Hurin, Hurin being the plot that ties everything in. I find it interesting that Hurin's doom was to watch the curse on his family rather than be tortured himself. This being the case he is obviously perfect to narrate and frame the story. However, it seems a little less sentimental for this to be related to Thingol, for instance. Additionally the dialouge between Hurin and Morwen seems like a good set up for the story. With lines such as "But you are late, too late- they are lost" and "If you know, tell me. How did she find him?" it would only seem natural for the story to unfold from there...

I like the idea of tying the Fall of Gondolin in as a sequel. That could make a good adjoiner between the two stories.

--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 19:12, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

== The Early Chapters ==

When thinking about the Narn as a screenplay or even a movie, I was considering if it would be important to show some of the earlier parts and how this would occur (considering what structure the screenplay takes, as noted above). Is it too much to include things such as the subplot concerning Gondolin? or would it be wrong to cut things like that out? Or, rather, should that plot go to [[The Fall of Gondolin Screenplay]]? --[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 12:05, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/Narn i Chîn Húrin

2009-04-07T19:12:28Z

Maeglin: /* Structure */

Well, this seems to be fairly unused, but I'd like to start working on this if anyone else would.
--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 12:05, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

== Gurthang speaking ==

On a minor note, is it entirely important to make Gurthang speak in the end where Turin dies? I think that could be construed as a little.... silly? I'm not quite sure, but it seems it would be better without. I certainly don't want to change the story, but it doesn't seem to insignificant to cut.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 19:35, 6 June 2008 (EDT)

:We could adjust the form of Gurthang's "speaking" to mental messages when his eye meets someone. I'm sure a good director could make something good out of it, but it does seem odd to have a great dragon talking like a man. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil]] 00:11, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

== Hurin in the Story ==

This for me is a rather confusing part of the story to deal with, as Hurin is a focal point but not in the tale very much. Generally I have a few ideas as well as a few things to think about:

I think Hurin should obviously be intertwined with the story. How? I have a few ideas but perhaps not clear enough.

I would like to see the 'movie' end as the book does, with Morwen dying at Turin's monument. It is an emotional part of the story and completes the tragedy for Hurin (ie; he has failed in life, been tortured, watched his children die in tragedy and now at the culmination of it all he has lost his wife.)

It would also be interesting to intertwine Hurin with visits to Thangorodrim showing how Hurin is taking this all, but I'm not sure how it would work. Is this a good idea?

Finally concerning Hurin, could he narrate the tale?

--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 12:05, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

:This is a tricky spot indeed. Hurin narrating might work, what about instead of ending with Morwen's death, throughout the story the narrator's voice goes from powerful and strong and slowly diminishes until the last scene in which he throws himself into the Great Sea in despair. I suppose it may weaken the impact if we have too many tragic deaths near the end of the film but not telling the end of Hurin and the end of the curse seems to do injustice. Intertwining Hurin into the middle of the story is a must as we can't just show him at the beginning and at the end, even if we only cut to him a few short times it'll improve the audience's connection with him. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 13:53, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

:I like that idea. Hurin's weakening voice would be great. I still think Hurin's finding Morwen bears great sentimental value to the story, so perhaps the 'narration' finishes after we see the final scene in the actual Narn where Turin commits sucicide. When that scene ends the narration is done and it blends to the same spot, but years later. The reuniting of Hurin and Morwen ensues and after her death we show Hurin's end. All his family is dead and the curse is complete. I agree the curse needs to be emphasized, but at the same time it can't be too mystical, so it can be agreeable to 'tolkien scholars' and regular people. Does that work?

I think the tragic deaths can be spaced out andstill have impact. I think Turin and Nienor flow fine without losing impact, and Morwen is portrayed as the last thing Hurin has, this culminates to his death. If shown right it should work.
--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 19:32, 6 June 2008 (EDT)

== Structure ==

Since this is a complex tale, especially because it is about Hurin, but focuses on the deeds of Turin. This presents opportuninty to make a more complex style of movie. Maybe this is Hurin watching it all, or perhaps it begins with Hurin wandering after he is released and is a series of flashbacks until he finds Morwen. Maybe Hurin is relating the story of what happened to their children to Morwen, who remembers who she is after wandering for all these years(Is that too much like 'The Notebook'? I haven't seen it but I heard something similar happens.). At any rate, does anyone have ideas? I think it is the perfect tale to do something a little 'different' with rather than just showing the story unfold.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 12:05, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

:I would rather prefer that the encounter of Húrin and Morwen be the climax or nearly so. Instead perhaps we could switch events around so that Húrin is telling his tale to, say, [[Thingol]]. He tells of his escape and how Morgoth placed him high and set him to watch the doom of his children. He wraps up the movie by his release and the death of Mîm. Then we return to where Húrin stands before Thingol and departs in anguish. At the very end of the film, Húrin finds Morwen. If the story of the Fall of Gondolin was made as a sort of sequel, we could also include Húrin's shouting at the mountains (otherwise it holds no meaning with the audience). --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil]] 00:11, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

I've been rather busy, but have been looking into this again lately... anyway, I think the story should focus on the children of Hurin, Hurin being the plot that ties everything in. I find it interesting that Hurin's doom was to watch the curse on his family rather than be tortured himself. This being the case he is obviously perfect to narrate and frame the story. However, it seems a little less sentimental for this to be related to Thingol, for instance. Additionally the dialouge between Hurin and Morwen seems like a good set up for the story. With lines such as "But you are late, too late- they are lost" and "If you know, tell me. How did she find him?" it would only seem natural for the story to unfold from there...

I like the idea of tying the Fall of Gondolin in as a sequel. That could make a good adjoiner between the two stories.

--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 19:12, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

== The Early Chapters ==

When thinking about the Narn as a screenplay or even a movie, I was considering if it would be important to show some of the earlier parts and how this would occur (considering what structure the screenplay takes, as noted above). Is it too much to include things such as the subplot concerning Gondolin? or would it be wrong to cut things like that out? Or, rather, should that plot go to [[The Fall of Gondolin Screenplay]]? --[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 12:05, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

User talk:Narfil Palùrfalas

2009-03-23T04:04:33Z

Maeglin: /* RE: Fall of Gondolin screenplay */

== Hi Narfil! ==
I'm the head of the Tolkienian eZine "the voice of edoras".
I ask you a collaboration with the eZine.
reply to: edoras@alice.it

:I'm afraid I'm unaware of what the "Tolkienian eZine" is. Could you please inform me further as to its nature? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 18:08, 9 January 2007 (EST)

yeah...an eZine is a magazine legible online. The eZine "the voice of edoras" talk about Tolkien's works, Fantasy generaliter, RPG & MMORPGS. write on my mail, so i can give you the http of the eZine and you can create an idea more clear.
edoras@alice.it

:Sorry, but I don't have an email account set up currently. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 12:50, 11 January 2007 (EST)

you don't have an email???
...however, if you can collaborate contact me:edoras@alice.it
the site is: http://lavocediedoras.altervista.org/ (I hope is permitted to release it^^)

:The lack of email is only temporary. Anyway, I'm not exactly sure I understand what you are asking for (Hyarion, do you have an opinion?). --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 16:26, 15 January 2007 (EST)

== Maedhros' mother-name ==
Hello Narfil. Quick question about Maedhros. You have has mother name as ''Caitimo'' in the [[Sons of Fëanor]] entry, but as ''Maitimo'' in the [[Maedhros]] entry. Since I don't have the reference books in front of me, do you remember which is the right entry? Thanks for the help. --[[User:Ebakunin|Ebakunin]] 18:41, 27 April 2006 (EDT)

Sorry. ''Maitimo'' is right. For some reason I have it in my head as ''Caitimo'', but this is not correct. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 20:42, 27 April 2006 (EDT)

==Lay of Leithian==
One of my current projects is working on the [[Lay of Leithian]]-related material on this site. I have thus far carried on the project by myself, finishing up a summary of every Canto on this day. I am trying to type out and post every canto, but it is very time-consuming. I was hoping that others who posses a copy of [[the Lays of Beleriand]] might help and finish the task. Also, thanks for the corrections, Ebakunin. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 16:48, 6 May 2006 (EDT)

:No problem. You're doing all the heavy lifting. I'm just cleaning up the crumbs. --[[User:Ebakunin|Ebakunin]] 17:06, 6 May 2006 (EDT)

:Hello, your doing a phenomenal job with the articles. I might have some text from the Lay of Leithian I can send you. If you want to either let me know what your email is or click "Preferences" to validate your email and then click to allow email from other users then I can send it that way. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 18:18, 6 May 2006 (EDT)

== Aulë's Valarin Name ==
Narfil, would you please double-check [[Aulë]]'s Valarin name? On my browser it looks like this: ''A3ûlêz''. Notice the number 3. Thanks. --[[User:Ebakunin|Ebakunin]] 12:46, 14 May 2006 (EDT)

:The number '3' is on purpose; the spirant equivalent of 'g'. See http://www.uib.no/People/hnohf/valarin.htm for an explanation. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 12:54, 14 May 2006 (EDT)

::Actually I think the 3 was just there because of the inability to render the correct symbol. '''Aȝûlêz''' should be correct if I'm not mistaken. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 12:57, 14 May 2006 (EDT)

:::On my browser whatever you put in showed as an empty square. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 12:58, 14 May 2006 (EDT)

::::Odd, the second character is a [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yogh yogh] and renders fine on my screen. I'll look into it. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 13:02, 14 May 2006 (EDT)

:::::After some searching, I found the HTML codes for upper and lower case '''yoghs''': Ʒ and ʒ, as in Aʒûlêz. See the edit page for the actual codes ;-)
:::::Edit: I see, though, that the codes don't work on MicroSocks' IE. *rolls eyes* --[[User:Earendilyon|Earendilyon]] 15:40, 14 May 2006 (EDT)

== More Maps ==
Narfil, could you make a map of [[Númenor]] using MS Fireworks? I really like what you did with [[Gondolin]]. Thanks. --[[User:Ebakunin|Ebakunin]] 18:23, 11 June 2006 (EDT)

:Sure. I'll get to work with that. By the way, don't expect the 3d Gondolin for another week or so. I was rather lazy with it last week. Now its just down to multi-replicating the houses to fit the many streets and roadways. Rather boring but time-consuming. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 09:37, 12 June 2006 (EDT)

::Done! Tell me what you think. The tree [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]] drew, by the way. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 18:41, 12 June 2006 (EDT)

:I like it a lot. One small thing: could you use a standard font like Tahoma or Ariel for region and city names? The fantasy script is tough to read when its small type. --[[User:Ebakunin|Ebakunin]] 18:56, 12 June 2006 (EDT)

::I was thinking about changing the region font as it is hard to read. But if you do see the map full size the font on the cities isn't that small. If you try it full size and you still don't like it, I'll change it to Times New Roman or Ariel. Any other suggestions? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 19:05, 12 June 2006 (EDT)

:::Love the map Narfil! When you view it at full size the text is fine by me. Keep up the great work! --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 21:32, 12 June 2006 (EDT)

::I'd still like the cities to be in a more regular font. Most people are going to be looking at the map as an embedded image, rather than full screen. Just my two-cents. --[[User:Ebakunin|Ebakunin]] 21:35, 12 June 2006 (EDT)

:::I can do that. But still, in my opinion it would be too hard to read the names as an embedded image even if they were regular font. I didn't think the font was too hard to read, unless it were the region titles, but then I thought it was large enough. But I'll do that. Thanks. Another thing, though. Now I'm wondering if the tree image is a bit much. Unless you view it full size it looks like someone spilled coffee on the edge or something. It would make it less fancy, but as it is a map I suppose that's fine. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 21:39, 12 June 2006 (EDT)

==User pics==

I was just wondering, is it all right to upload pictures for your user page? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 08:42, 16 June 2006 (EDT)

:Yet again something that I have had on my mind but have yet to come to a conclusion on. I believe in the future we should set a limit to how many non-Tolkien images can be uploaded but as long as you are using them on your user page, and you don't have 100 of them on there, and your not using the site as an image hosting service (like uploading them but linking to them from other sites and not using them on pages here) then I think we are fine as space is not a problem. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 10:31, 16 June 2006 (EDT)

== Years Articles ==

Hello, go ahead and hold off on converting any more year articles. I was playing around with the Fourth Age last night and unfortunately it doesn't seem like we'll be able to do my 'include trick' I was hoping to. I'm kind of liking having the titles non-abbreviated, although ''Years of the Lamps 100'' does seem rather long. In the end I suppose we can always have redirects to all of the non-abbreviated titles. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 11:36, 27 July 2006 (EDT)

I just noticed that yesterday, July 29, only one person edited - and that was a non-member signing the Google petition. Is that supposed to tell us something, do you think? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 12:24, 30 July 2006 (EDT)

== Early return ==

Welcome back! Just was curious the reason for your early return, I hope you're vacation didn't get spoiled. It's glad to have you back though. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 22:18, 11 August 2006 (EDT)

:No, it didn't get spoiled. You see (or, I suppose, you do not), we have five children in my family, all younger than I. We had rented a small cabin in the woods (well, within a stone's throw of seven other identical cabins), expecting to be there until the thirteenth. But all of us were practically bored that time (and it rained a little), so we saw no reason to stay any more than two nights, which we did, and returned to spend the rest of our vacation time taking trips from the home. So, I'm technically still on vacation, though no longer away from my computer all day and night. I'll probably be gone much of today, but I'll be back tonight. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 08:52, 12 August 2006 (EDT)

== Image categorization ==

Hello Narfil, good idea on classifying those images. Do you think a category for images created in Bryce/Fireworks/etc may be too much? What do you think about a ''CG images'' or ''Computer generated images'' or ''CGI'' or something similar category? Otherwise we'd have to add Maya/Photoshop/Photodraw/Paint/etc. Just a thought. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 02:24, 13 August 2006 (EDT)

:You're right. But I do think we should distinguish between what, for instance, Bryce does, which is computer generating, and what Fireworks does, graphics, which is like Photoshop only more vector-oriented. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 18:29, 13 August 2006 (EDT)

==Moving page==
*I knew about the talk page moving as well so dw lol. And yes i have, i've been at home alot with nothing to do :'( [[User:Jasca Ducato|Jasca Ducato]] 15:38, 4 September 2006 (EDT)

== Wanted Pages ==
Hi, I've been looking through the Wanted Pages lately in an effort to expand the Wiki. I noticed that a whole lot of wanted articles come from empty links to things in your fanfictions and such. Would you mind clearing these up yourself so they don't clutter up the Wanted Pages? It's your work so I don't want to alter it. Thanks. [[User:Tar-Telperien|Tar-Telperien]] 19:28, 7 October 2006 (EDT)

:I'll do that right away. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 19:34, 7 October 2006 (EDT)

::Done. The only links to non-existing pages are actual [[Quenya]]/[[Sindarin]] words which need an article anyway. By the way, it is usually accepted to put new sections on talk pages at the bottom of the page. It doesn't really matter, but it helps to keep things in order. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 19:47, 7 October 2006 (EDT)

:::Thanks a lot, and thanks also for making me aware of this. I assumed new discussions were put on top of the page because that is how it is usually done on the internet (consider message boards, emails, etc.). I'll put new comments on this wiki on the bottom in the future. [[User:Tar-Telperien|Tar-Telperien]] 20:17, 7 October 2006 (EDT)

== TG Chat ==

Hi... I think you have heard about this before, but this wiki has a chat room in which people can more easily discuss editing plans in real time. I (and Hyarion too) would very much like to see you there! If you don't want to go to the trouble of installing an IRC client, and have Java on your computer, the Chat link on the side of this page will take you to the chatrooms. It's really easy to use. Hyarion and some others are nearly always around to talk to; he really likes having people there se he can discuss his plans for the wiki. Since you're one of the main editors, it'd be great to have you around for these discussions! I also admire your work and would like to be able to talk to you. [[User:Tar-Telperien|Tar-Telperien]] 02:33, 24 October 2006 (CDT)

:I haven't used it primarily because I don't know how to. I've never used anything like it before. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 08:09, 24 October 2006 (CDT)

::Hey there Narfil, I had a feeling that's why we never have seen you in there :) It's very easy and quite addicting, you definitely need to give it a try. Just use the [http://tolkiengateway.net/java Java link], sometimes it can take a while to load but a prompt will come up, just click yes you trust the applet and then you'll be automatically connected to the main channel. You can then chat, you can also change your name by typing "/nick Narfil". When we have a few more active editors we can setup weekly meetings to discuss the direction of the wiki and various other aspects. Sometimes chatting can be a lot easier than having to use talk pages. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 13:15, 24 October 2006 (CDT)

== Welcome template ==

The w template is a bit awkward and to display it right you actually have to type <nowiki>{{w|Narfil Palùrfalas|[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]]}}</nowiki> The first "variable" before the | is the link to your talk page and the second "variable" after the | is what is displayed as your signature. I'll have to fix it so the default {{w}} just doesn't display a signature/talk page link. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 22:03, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

== Edits ==

hello,
I have been told by Tar-Telperien and Hyarion that you have great knowledge regarding Tolkiens works,and all your articles confirm this.And I completely agree with what you have said about Gil-galad.

I do no wish to start an edit war with you.I only changed the Gil-galad's geneology because I thought that people who have read the Unfinished Tales and The Silmarillion would be under the impression that Gil-galad was Fingon's son,and I think I would be right to assume that most people do not know about the 'mistake' that Chris Tolkien made.And to them it would seem that Tolkiengateway is posting wrong information.

I am sorry if I have offended you in any way by editing your articles.But all I wanted to do was match the informatio that is present here with the information that is given in the books.

--[[User:Legolas|Legolas]]

:Perhaps, Narfil, in every article you write that contains a reference to [[Gil-galad]]'s parentage, you should have a note at the bottom of the page with the citations you gave [[User:Legolas|Legolas]]. He can't be the first person to have become confused about it. Furthermore, please try to be less confrontational in the future. I'm sure he had no intentions of starting an "edit war" with you, and bringing such terms into your conversation with him created far more friction than necessary. --[[User:Tar-Telperien|Tar-Telperien]] 00:56, 11 November 2006 (EST)

::I apologize if I sounded accusing. I did not believe you wanted to start an edit war, I just didn't want that to happen. By "edit war" I meant when two or more people constantly change the same article back and forth because of their interpretation of the facts. I thought the best way would be to post the references. Please understand that in no way did I think you wanted to start an edit war. I was not offended, but I apologize if I offended you. I'll try and add a footnote to the article (if I can figure out how to get that template to work). If you wish we can move this discussion to the Gil-galad talk page on how to fit the various scattered pieces of information into it. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 21:04, 11 November 2006 (EST)

== Speaking of that Gatekeeper thing... ==

Your [[Quenya]] is good but not quite "correct" (though it is from a certain point of view, see below). The main part I'm talking about is the phrase ''*Tirno Otya Andon'', "Keeper of the Seventh Gate" (the asterisk marks a construction not attested in Tolkien's writings). The suffix ''-n'' was indeed [[Tolkien]]'s marker for the Quenya genitive for some time, but while writing ''[[The Lord of the Rings]]'', he switched it to ''-o'', and ''-n'' became the dative ending instead. This change was apparently in effect for the rest of his life; as far as I know there is no record of Tolkien using any other suffix for genitive after changing to ''-o''. Thus, your phrase would actually mean "Keeper for a Seventh Gate", in Quenya as later envisioned by Tolkien.

So what happens to the genitive if the word to be inflected ends in ''-o'' already, you ask? It was simply hidden and implied by the context—an attested example is ''Indis i Ciryamo'', "The Mariner's Wife". ''Ciryamo'' is in the genitive here, but since it already has the agental suffix ''-mo'', we don't see the genitive marking. It is merely inferred from the context. Also, from this phrase it also seems that the definite article ''i'' was used in genitive constructions.

Thus, if I were you, I would translate "Keeper of the Seventh Gate" as ''*Tirno i Otya Ando''.

As for the sign itself, I quite like the coloring, it looks nice. However, I think the "G" in "TG" could use more of a stroke; it looks too much like a "C". —[[User:Tar-Telperien|Tar-Telperien]] 22:15, 13 November 2006 (EST)

:I know about the "G". I'm going to change it next time I upload.

:Thanks for your input on the Quenya. I can't speak Quenya, and most of my declension comes from Ardalambion. Are there any other examples of the definite article ''i'' in Quenya? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 07:55, 14 November 2006 (EST)

::There are several in Helge's wordlists; look up ''i'' in the Quenya list and ''THE'' in the English list if you are interested. I shall quote a section most relevant to our discussion, taken from the English entry: ''"When a noun is determined by a following genitive, it is evidently optional whether it takes the article or not: '''mannar Valion''' "into the hands [lit. simply "hands"] of the Lords", '''Indis i Ciryamo''' "The Mariner's Wife, *The Wife [lit. simply "Wife"] of the Mariner" - but contrast '''I Equessi Rúmilo''' "the Sayings of Rúmil", '''i arani Eldaron''' "the Kings of the Eldar"."'' —[[Helge Fauskanger]]

::(The reason the inflection appears as ''-ron'' in the last example is because that is the plural genitive for words ending in vowels (''Elda'' in this case); ''-ion'' is the plural genitive for words ending in consonants—hence ''Silmarillion'', "Of the Silmarils"!)

::So apparently, using ''i'' in genitive phrases is not required ''per se'', but appears more often than not. Also, I hadn't bothered to verify your use of ''otya'' for "seventh" until I was looking at these lists to get that quote! I discovered that the Quenya word for "seventh" is actually '''''otsëa''''' instead! So that would require another change to your translation: it would most likely be ''*Tirno i Otsëa Ando'' (which in speech would probably be elided as "''*Tirno i Otsë' Ando''"), actually. Sorry for not checking that earlier. —[[User:Tar-Telperien|Tar-Telperien]] 15:07, 14 November 2006 (EST)

:::I got the ''Otya'' from [http://www.uib.no/People/hnohf/numerals.htm here], again an Ardalambion site. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 17:31, 14 November 2006 (EST)

::::Ah. But notice that Helge says in that document that these numbers and ordinals are unattested formations, created by analogy with attested examples—and that was true, at the time. ''Otya'' was indeed a good guess based on what was published when he wrote that document. But it is out of date; ''otsëa'' (and probably the other ordinals as well) has been attested in ''[[Vinyar Tengwar]]'' 42, which was published relatively recently, clearly after he wrote that document anyway. When in doubt, go with the information in the wordlists: they are quite complete, are updated often, and only show attested information. —[[User:Tar-Telperien|Tar-Telperien]] 18:20, 14 November 2006 (EST)

== [[Main Page/Development]] ==

Hey there Narfil, if you get a chance I could use some help over on the new page, specifically with the new portals, I want to make sure they are at least not entirely under construction and at least have a new color scheme when we launch the new main page, hopefully on the day [[The Children of Hurin]] is released. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 15:32, 1 April 2007 (EDT)

:I'll go look at that. That day is coming up soon, isn't it? At least this gives me a somewhat easier project. I was not looking forward to the amount of work needing to be done on the "[[Witch-king of Angmar]]" and "[[Arda]]". Still, I suppose I'll do it some other Saturday or Sunday if I don't get to it today. By the way, on those articles I mentioned, do you think a complete rewrite would be in order? In my opinion it would be easier and probably turn out better. If I have the chance today I'll write out a draft (or drafts), post it here, and see what you think. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 15:40, 1 April 2007 (EDT)

::Thanks, and it is coming up very quickly, Beren and I are working non-stop trying to make sure the [[The Children of Hurin Release Party|Release Party]] goes smoothly, hopefully we'll have some new editors after that. I think we need to rewrite most of the articles, including the two you mentioned and I agree it will not only be easier but turn out better. Thanks for all your hard work! --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 15:46, 1 April 2007 (EDT)

== Positions and occupations ==

Seems like a good catergory to me.
[[User:Findegil|Findegil]] 09:28, 22 April 2007 (EDT)

==Back from Israel, and Image suggestion==

The chat hasn't worked for me today, so I'm just saying here that I've returned from my three-and-a-half-week trip to Israel, and should resume regular editing in a few days. I got an idea on the trip, as to images. Is it a good idea to upload images of real-life places that look like what we'd imagine Tolkien places to look like and place them on that page? We have images from films which is often essentially that. For instance, I've taken several pictures of the Rephaim valley, which just had me the entire time thinking of [[Dorthonion]]. Is it a good idea, or do you think it might get out of hand? I think it could very well get out of hand if we had a lot of people uploading images of dozens of places that remind them of what they'd personally pictured such and such to look like, etc. On the other hand, though, it might be quite beneficial. What are your thoughts? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 21:09, 6 June 2007 (EDT)

:Hyarion, do you have an opinion on this? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 15:54, 10 June 2007 (EDT)

::Sorry, I read this but forgot to respond. Actually working on the java client right now, should be up today or tomorrow. My first impression was the same as yours, that it would probably get out of hand with images only remotely resembling their Arda counter-parts. I think real-life images of locations around England that may have inspired Tolkien would be a good idea, but unless something is just dead-on, we should probably stick to imagery specifically created to represent Tolkien's world. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 16:13, 10 June 2007 (EDT)

:::The Java applets should now be working again. Sorry about that. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 14:21, 16 June 2007 (EDT)

== Rejig of [[The Fall of Gondolin]] ==

Hi there, i was just browsing the [[Fall of Gondolin]] article and i have a bit of a criticism of it, which i fealt you, being the major author (so i've heard), thought i'd come and voice them with you and get your blessing before i go in and bugger things up. My criticism is that i think the bulk of the text reads too much like the actual source it's about. The problem with that is that it can be confusing since people who havnt read the text (which i hadnt when i first came across the article) could take it as being quoted rather than summerised. I would favour rewriting it in a far more detached style so as to make the destinction clear. Part and parcel of that criticism is the fact that most articles on battles are decidedly more concise omitting any dialogue whereas the Fall of Gondolin features it extensively.

I'm trying to word this very carefully since it's plainly a tour-du-force of article writing but feel it could be better done differently. [[User:Dr Death|Dr Death]] 13:17, 20 June 2007 (EDT)

:Feel free to rewrite it. I was younger at the time (it makes a big difference around my age), and had some different ideas. I agree, it was an overall poor summary. I actually was considering redoing it completely myself. Go ahead and do what you like with the article. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 16:28, 20 June 2007 (EDT)

== Spammer(s) at it again ==

Narfil,

Pardon my language but we need to find some way to ban these **** spammer(s)!!!--[[User:Dwarf Lord|Dwarf Lord]] 17:26, 9 August 2007 (EDT)

:I'm sorry, but I'm not an admin, and really have no power over things like that. Hyarion's in Washington, but when he gets back, you can post something on his page. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 21:24, 9 August 2007 (EDT)

::I'm back :) Thanks for holding down the fort guys. The spammers are most likely coming from a single source which uses random IPs so there isn't much we can do to block them if they don't insert external links (we have spam protection against bots that add external links). We'll be adding better prevention systems in the future, but at the moment I don't want to force all the anonymous users to type a captcha. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 14:30, 10 August 2007 (EDT)

== [[Template:Hobbit]] ==

Allo Narfil, I see your point in the Race being redundant in the Hobbit infobox, but I don't think it's necessarily a bad idea, it adds some extra information to the minor Hobbit articles, otherwise the infobox just lists their name and gender. But I'm fine with it either way. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 15:14, 3 October 2007 (EDT)

:I think we should try and think up some way to have each infobox specify which race it belongs to other than just color. If we don't see a way, it would be good to add "race", but not as a variable. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 16:50, 3 October 2007 (EDT)

== Gandalf Article ==

Hello there. I am curious why you think this is better:

"Representatives of most of the free peoples attended, those who happened to be in Imladris already for various reasons."

I changed it previously because it appeared to be poor grammar and inaccurate and misleading.

Yes they 'happened to be there'-- all were 'summoned' in various ways. As written however it could be misinterpreted by casual readers.

Would you approve "... , some happened to be in Imladris already"?

Cheers [[User:Glorfindel Mk. II|Glorfindel Mk. II]]

:Hmm, the reason I changed it was because I felt it was misleading. Elrond never summoned them; they had come to Rivendell for various reasons and "just happened" to be there at the time of the council (i.e., divine will).

{{quote|That is the purpose for which you are called hither. Called, I say, though I have not called you to me, strangers from distant lands. You have come and are here met, in this very nick of time, by chance as it may seem. Yet it is not so. Believe rather that it is so ordered that we, who sit here, and none others, must now find counsel for the peril of the world.|[[Elrond]], ''[[The Council of Elrond]]''}}

:You are no doubt aware of this quote, but I just wanted to have it up front. I am sure we can work out the best phrasing for this piece. You are right, the structure of the sentence as I wrote it is rather awkward. I don't like "some happened to be in Imladris already" because it seems to say that Elrond literally called people to his council, and some, well, happened to be in Imladris already. As I said before, I'm sure we can work something out. Of course, it's rather insignificant in the article as a whole, and isn't even necessary if we don't want it there. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 20:18, 15 October 2007 (EDT)

:: You are correct that they were all there by 'chance' (as Gandalf might say) and not summoned so to speak. JRRT is obviously implying that the Valar and/or Eru had a hand in this 'coincidence.'

::I was thinking of when Elrond upbraided Sam for his presence at a council to which he was not 'summoned.'

::Perhaps it is not required anyway as this is the article on 'Gandalf' and not 'The Council of Elrond.'

::Cheers [[User:Glorfindel Mk. II|Glorfindel Mk. II]] 18:39, 16 October 2007 (EDT)

== Seven Gates of Gondolin ==

Hey Narfil, if you can spare some time then will you please draw the images for the remaining three gates of Gondolin? I have written the articles for them.--[[User:Legolas|Legolas]] 10:01, 21 October 2007 (EDT)

:Sorry about that, I'll try and get that done. The other remaining gates are considerably more difficult than the others. You can go ahead and post your articles if you like, because I daresay they'll be a while in coming. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 12:54, 21 October 2007 (EDT)

::Hello Narfil, the Image of the Gate of Silver is excellent. Very nice job.--[[User:Legolas|Legolas]] 01:04, 24 November 2007 (EST)

:::Thank you. I've actually benefited somewhat from its rather strenuous making. Now I know how to do trees in Bryce. . . The Gate of Gold will be coming (hopefully) soon. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 10:48, 24 November 2007 (EST)

==Canon Scale Images==
Hey Narfil, the canon scale images are great. They're useful and look good. However, do you think you could upload somewhat larger versions? At present they are difficult to read. —[[User:Tar-Telperien|Tar-Telperien]] 07:08, 29 November 2007 (EST)

== IRC ==

Allo Narfil, long time no chat. Hope you're having fun at school. I see you stopped by the chat earlier, dangit, of course I was sleeping :) We've just about got enough IRC-wiki editors where I think we'll be setting up weekly meetings, is any time good for you or do you think you'll be busy with school? Happy Holidays. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 13:22, 19 December 2007 (EST)

:Greetings, Hyarion. It's been a good while since we've talked. Well, I'm not sure I'll have much time to edit after the Christmas-New Years break is over, but I'll try. I am not available Monday, Thursday, or Friday nights, and it's on-off Sundays. Saturday, Tuesday, or Wednesday evenings would probably work for me. I'll have to see what my schedule looks like later. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 15:45, 19 December 2007 (EST)

==You should probably know==
Brythonic and Old Welsh aren't Germanic languages.

:Yes, thank you. That was a mistake on my part, and I'd forgotten to change it. I appreciate that you caught that, though. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 21:20, 1 March 2008 (EST)

== Meetings ==

Hi! I just wanted to draw your attention to [[Forum:Meetings|here]]. We are currently discussing the idea of a weekly site meeting. Thanks!--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 18:15, 7 August 2008 (EDT)

== There is a question on the [[Elves|elven]] discussion board that I suggest to you you answer.==

Since in part that you have such a advance knowledge of [[tolkien]] as you claim to be and that it hadn't been answered yet (well somebody else kind of did but I think that's not justiable enough.)and so forth. Thanks.

==Pallando images==
If you say they're Merlin, I very much feel like deleting them... I'd rather have no picture than an inaccurate one. -- {{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:45, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

== Maedhros' portrait ==

Hi! You've got [http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Image:Maedhros_sketch.jpeg a portrait of Maedhros] uploaded as unknown, I was going to edit info but I think it's better if you do it yourself. [http://www.geocities.com/ivanneth63/Maedhros.html This image (direct link to original)] has been done by Ivanneth, fantastic [http://www.geocities.com/ivanneth63/ artist] and [http://www.fanfiction.net/u/283154/Ivanneth author], check her art, there are more treasures hidden on her page. It would be great if you correct the information and added wiki about her, including her portfolio link. Regards! --[[User:Sirielle|Sirielle]] 20:14, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

:It looks like it's already been taken care of. Thanks for letting me know, though. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil]] 15:50, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

::Yes, I did it after I got instructions what way to do it - Ederchil helped me with it and fixed things I messed.--[[User:Sirielle|Sirielle]] 01:39, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

== Re: Fall of Gondolin screenplay ==

Hi Narfil,
My greatest apologies: I haven't been here for quite some time andsubsequently missed your message. However, the edits you suggest are all splenid ideas. If you see any more, by all means- go right ahead. Again, my apologies for bing so late on this; if such a situation arises again, feel free to forgo my consent.

Thanks for the edits as well, they're really good.

User talk:Narfil Palùrfalas

2009-03-23T04:03:58Z

Maeglin:

User talk:Narfil Palùrfalas

2009-03-23T04:03:32Z

Maeglin: /* RE: Fall of Gondolin screenplay */ new section

User talk:Narfil Palùrfalas

2009-03-23T03:39:07Z

Maeglin: /* Re: Fall of Gondolin screenplay */ new section

User:Maeglin

2008-08-11T03:18:54Z

Maeglin: /* About Me */

== About Me ==

'''Tolkien-wise'''
I am an amatuer or even novice 'tolkienist' and lover of his works. While I certainly am not an average 'fan' that only love the movies I still have a ways to go in Tolkein learning, so I'm not sure how much I can contribute

'''Personal'''
I am a devout Christian, which makes, in my opinion, Tolkien's hidden theology stand out. Additionally I am homeschooled, and participate in Speech and Debate, which is why I like writing articles and such.

==Book List==

The Silmarillion

The Children of Hurin

The Hobbit

The Lord of the Rings

'''Partially Read'''
I've read a few of these so far....

The Unfinished Tales

The Book of Lost Tales Part 2

User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/Narn i Chîn Húrin

2008-06-06T23:35:06Z

Maeglin:

User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/Narn i Chîn Húrin

2008-06-06T23:32:29Z

Maeglin: /* Hurin in the Story */

Well, this seems to be fairly unused, but I'd like to start working on this if anyone else would.
--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 12:05, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

== Hurin in the Story ==

This for me is a rather confusing part of the story to deal with, as Hurin is a focal point but not in the tale very much. Generally I have a few ideas as well as a few things to think about:

I think Hurin should obviously be intertwined with the story. How? I have a few ideas but perhaps not clear enough.

I would like to see the 'movie' end as the book does, with Morwen dying at Turin's monument. It is an emotional part of the story and completes the tragedy for Hurin (ie; he has failed in life, been tortured, watched his children die in tragedy and now at the culmination of it all he has lost his wife.)

It would also be interesting to intertwine Hurin with visits to Thangorodrim showing how Hurin is taking this all, but I'm not sure how it would work. Is this a good idea?

Finally concerning Hurin, could he narrate the tale?

--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 12:05, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

:This is a tricky spot indeed. Hurin narrating might work, what about instead of ending with Morwen's death, throughout the story the narrator's voice goes from powerful and strong and slowly diminishes until the last scene in which he throws himself into the Great Sea in despair. I suppose it may weaken the impact if we have too many tragic deaths near the end of the film but not telling the end of Hurin and the end of the curse seems to do injustice. Intertwining Hurin into the middle of the story is a must as we can't just show him at the beginning and at the end, even if we only cut to him a few short times it'll improve the audience's connection with him. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 13:53, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

:I like that idea. Hurin's weakening voice would be great. I still think Hurin's finding Morwen bears great sentimental value to the story, so perhaps the 'narration' finishes after we see the final scene in the actual Narn where Turin commits sucicide. When that scene ends the narration is done and it blends to the same spot, but years later. The reuniting of Hurin and Morwen ensues and after her death we show Hurin's end. All his family is dead and the curse is complete. I agree the curse needs to be emphasized, but at the same time it can't be too mystical, so it can be agreeable to 'tolkien scholars' and regular people. Does that work?

I think the tragic deaths can be spaced out andstill have impact. I think Turin and Nienor flow fine without losing impact, and Morwen is portrayed as the last thing Hurin has, this culminates to his death. If shown right it should work.
--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 19:32, 6 June 2008 (EDT)

== Structure ==

Since this is a complex tale, especially because it is about Hurin, but focuses on the deeds of Turin. This presents opportuninty to make a more complex style of movie. Maybe this is Hurin watching it all, or perhaps it begins with Hurin wandering after he is released and is a series of flashbacks until he finds Morwen. Maybe Hurin is relating the story of what happened to their children to Morwen, who remembers who she is after wandering for all these years(Is that too much like 'The Notebook'? I haven't seen it but I heard something similar happens.). At any rate, does anyone have ideas? I think it is the perfect tale to do something a little 'different' with rather than just showing the story unfold.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 12:05, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

== The Early Chapters ==

When thinking about the Narn as a screenplay or even a movie, I was considering if it would be important to show some of the earlier parts and how this would occur (considering what structure the screenplay takes, as noted above). Is it too much to include things such as the subplot concerning Gondolin? or would it be wrong to cut things like that out? Or, rather, should that plot go to [[The Fall of Gondolin Screenplay]]? --[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 12:05, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/Narn i Chîn Húrin

2008-06-03T16:05:02Z

Maeglin: just getting things started around here.

Races

2008-05-22T23:21:37Z

Maeglin: oops- forgot 2 take of the stub & cleanup. I think it's safe 2 say those aren't needed anymore....

Many '''races''' inhabit [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]]'s '''legendarium'''. They vary in appearance, intellect, manner and more, but will here be divided into two specific categories: Those who speak, and are thus (for the most part) intelligent, and beasts tat are known to talk.

== Origins ==
Each race has it's origin, and each of those is different. In the beggining there was [[Eru]], [[Iluvatar]], the Creator. He has no beginning according to Tolkien's [[Legendarium]] and so from him come all other races. First he makes [[Ainur]], the holy ones. He prepares to make a creation of [[Elves]], then the [[Men]]. These races are blessed amongst the other races, who primarily come afterwards by other means.

==Ainur==
===Valar===

The [[Valar]] are the first actual race, but do not really take regular appearance in [[Middle Earth]], being considered Gods. They are the dominant Ainur, the other holy beings serving them (with the exception of Eru). They are spiritual form, but do take physical form when they speak to the peoples of [[Arda]]. They live in [[Aman]]. Each Valar have their own purpose, much like the mythological gods of Greece and Rome.

They are as follows:

*[[Manwë]] is the chief of the Valar

*[[Varda]] is the chief goddess of the Valier, Maker of the stars and spouse of Manwë]]

*[[Aule]] is the smith and master of crafts.

*[[Yavanna]] is the Goddess of nature

*[[Vana]] is called the ever young. Spouse of Oromë and sister of Yavanna.

*[[Oromë]], for he is the god of the hunt.

*[[Tulkas]] was greatest of the Valar in strenght and deeds of prowess.

*[[Melkor]], called [[Morgoth]] by the [[Noldor]], he went astray and was jealous of the other valar. Because of this he became the first [[Dark Lord]] and rebelled against the Valar, bringing evil into the world.

*[[Ulmo]], lord of the waters.

*[[Mandos|Námo Mandos]], keeper of death in his famed halls.

*[[Irmo|Irmo Lórien]], lord of dreams

*[[Nienna]]

*[[Estë]]

*[[Vairë]]

*[[Nessa]]

===Maiar===

The [[Maiar]] are lesser Ainur, being servants to the Valar. They are seen more often carrying out tasks in middle earth. Most notable are: [[Sauron]], servant of Melkor, [[Ossë]], servant of Ulmo, [[Melian]], who married the elf, [[Elu Thingol]]. There are many Maia, and certainly more than the valar. Many are noted but some are just counted among the servants of the Valar. Notably among these are the [[Balrogs]], demons of fire, who are possessed with spirits of Maiar.

====Istari====

The [[Istari]] are Maiar, sent by the Valar in the form of Men, or rather [[wizards]], in order to aid the fight against evil. Being Maiar they have extraordinary capabilities, being able to turn the tide of many a battle. Because of their great power there need not be many of them, so there were five. They were led first by [[Saruman]], The White, who headed the order. He later turned to evil and became [[Saruman of Many Colors]], forsaking his position in the order. Replacing him was [[Gandalf]], the Grey, who was later Gandalf, the White, signifying his leadership of the order. It was he who aided the [[Fellowship of the Ring]] in their quest to destroy the [[Ring of Power]], also aiding defenders of [[Minas Tirith]] against Sauron's host, as well as a host of other deeds. The third is [[Radagast]], the Brown, who was renowned for his love of nature and capability of conversing with it, but it is said he was distracted from his course. The last two are eluded to often as the [[Blue Wizards]], whose names were [[Alatar]] and [[Pallando]] when they were in Valinor. It is said they went east and strayed to evil. Their names were then [[Morinehtar]] and [[Rómestámo]], respectively. They are hardly spoken of after they went east. So of all the five Istari, only Gandalf [[Mithrandir]] stayed true to their original duty.

== Elves ==
[[Elves]], called the [[Firstborn]] of Illuvatar, were the first people of middle earth. They were created by Eru and are described generally as tall and fair, but have many specific characteristics. They were placed in middle earth and summoned for a journey to Aman. They are divided by those who refused, those who stopped along the way and those who made it to Aman.

== Men ==

[[Men]] were the secondborn, looking much like Elves but slightly less in stature, and not as fair. They never were accepted in Aman, but for a few special exceptions. They too are separated in loyalty, but still comprise a majority of those who are 'good', and are called [[Edain]]. Evil men include the [[Swarthy men]] or [[Easterlings]]. Later on they developed into more advanced peoples including the men of [[Gondor]] and [[Numenor]], but some remained unsophisticated as those of [[Rohan]] and [[Harad]]. Being second they are cut off in smaller tribes at first, but later the dominion of Men surpasses elves as the leaders of middle-earth.

=== Hobbits===

[[Hobbits]] are an offshoot of men, but rather shorter than the 'Big Folk', as they call them. They have many defining characteristics that make them different from just short men and certainly not dwarves. While their exact origin is unknown, they are known as perhaps an offshoot of men. Not dealing in te affairs of other races they inhabit specific regions. There are several varieties including the Hobbits of the [[Shire]] and the [[Riverfolk]]

== Dwarves ==

The [[Dwarves]] came last of the 'good' peoples, though they are not intrinsically good. They were made by Aulë, who in eagerness to create people of his own, made the Dwarves, despite the fact that he could not inspire life. Because of this he was forced to destroy them, but at the last moment Manwë had pity on them, and so the Dwarves came to existence. Short in stature and hardy, they keep to themselves and are prone to good or evil.

==Ents==

[[Ents]] are Shepherds of the trees, and though looking very much like them are certainly not trees. They stand as humans but tower in the treetops and are covered in foliage. They originally tended the trees in [[Beleriand]] and lived happily with their [[Entwives]]. However, after the new shaping of the world they were lost and the Ents slowly died out.

==Orcs==

[[Orcs]] were originally created by Morgoth as a mockery of the Elves which Eru created. Fearing light they try to remain hidden or are provided for with dark clouts from their master. The making of Orcs was called Morgoth's most despicable act. How they come about is unknown; it is said they were created by tortured elves in Morgoth's dungeons, but how and of what frequency this happened is unknown. They, however, cannot be created of nothing, as only Eru can truly do this. Orcs spread wide as servants of evil. Some worked in manual service, many were warriors- basic troops that could spread fear and evil across the country, and others were wild, bound to evil service but going where they will.

===Greater Orcs===

[[Greater Orcs]] are not spoken much of, excepy in the earlier tales of [[Arda]]. Generally they are stronger and larger than regular orcs.

===Goblins===
[[Goblins]] are a smaller, more wild species of orc. Most of them dwell in caves, such as the infamous subterranean goblins of [[Moria]]. This by all means does not mean Goblins are completely bestial, and indeed were rather organized at times, especially under kings such as [[Azog]]. Additionally, Goblins do not always stay underground, but indeed prefer it as they hate light.

===Uruk-Hai===
[[Uruk-hai]] are a larger breed of orcs made by Saruman after he turned to evil. They are larger and stronger than the average orc as well as more disciplined and intelligent (to certain degree), and probably most importantly they are not afraid of the sun. A cross between men and orc the name Uruk-Hai means 'orc-folk'. They had greater success than their smaller counterpart, but only came towards the end of the [[Third Age]] and Sauron's destruction.

==Troll==

[[Trolls]] were made by Morgoth in mockery of Ents, as orcs were of elves. They are large humanoid creatures that vary in type. Generally trolls too fear the sun and even turn to stone if exposed to it. Made before the first age many went into hiding and reappear in service of Sauron.

===Cave Trolls===

[[Cave-trolls]] are a subterranean variety of troll, seen frequently in Tolkien's writings, particularly in the [[Battle of the Chamber of Mazarbul]]. They areincapable of speech and so are probably not considered an organized race, but none the less are still trolls.

===Hill and Snow Trolls===

[[Hill Trolls|Hill]] and [[Snow Trolls]] are mentioned only a little in Tolkien's works, but none the less do make a presence. Their names give explanation to their appearance and dwelling, but for the most part they are like regular trolls. While they are not spoken of much, they do make prominent appearance in Electronic Art's [[The Battle for Middle-earth II - The Rise of the Witch-king]]

===Olog-Hai===

[[Olog-Hai]] were a larger, stronger and (slightly) more intelligent breed of of troll. Created by Sauron in the third age, their largest advantage to regular trolls perhaps is that they do not turn to stone in daylight. Olog-Hai are to normal trolls as Uruk-Hai are to normal orcs, and they are indeed to be feared.

----
Here follows beasts known to speak:

==Eagles==

The great [[Eagles]] played instumental role in the fight against evil, especially considering how lofty they were and the fact that they were still 'beasts'. These giant Eagles were sent from [[Valinor]] to aid the will of the Valar. This way the Ainur did not become physically involved in the affairs of Middle-Earth, but still could lend aid. This is of course not to say the Eagles would aid Elves and Men on a whim, but would generally only come at most dire need in order to change course of Middle-Earth.

==Ravens==

The [[Ravens]] of Middle-Earth were also of extrodanairy skill, but not in combat. Like the Eagles, they too bore tremendous eyesight and so were exceptional spies and scouts. Unlike Eagles they were not inclined specifically to good or evil, but were used by both. Known masters could be good, such as Radagast the Brown, but could also be Evil, such as when Saruman used the [[Crebain]] of [[Dunland]] to spy on the [[Fellowship]]. A small but useful tool, they could be effective in their own way.

==Wolves==

The [[Wolves]] of Middle-Earth were a fearsome lot. Curious enough, they were all evil while [[Huan]], a domestic hound, was a champion of good. At any rate, the wolves developed over the years into a variety of fearsome beasts, all terrifying.

===Werewolves===

Perhaps the fiercest Wolves of Middle-Earth, the [[Werewolves]] were a groteque creation by Morgoth. Giant Wolves embodied with a tortured spirit, they were some of the fiercest beasts of Morgoth's reign. Famous among them were [[Draugluin]] and [[Carcharoth]], both slain by [[Huan]]. Werewolves faded from the legendarium around the end of the first age, probably destroyed in the [[War of Wrath]].

===Wargs===

[[Wargs]] were a lesser version of their predecessors, created by [[Sauron]], most likely in remaking of the Werewolves which he used to command on [[Tol-in-Gaurhoth]] as [[Gorthaur]]. Many of these Wargs were enlisted as evil steeds, while others ran wild and grew into a large force of wild Wargs, who knew no allegiance, but were still inclined towards evil. They were known to speak, rarely, but in instances, such as those who attacked [[The Fellowship of the Ring]] in the chapter [[The Ring Goes South]].

==Spiders==

The giant [[Spiders]] of Middle-Earth were a widespread evil. They began when [[Ungoliant]], an evil Maiar, took form of spider and aided [[Morgoth]] in destruction of Valinor. She then fled to Middle-Earth and bred amongst the spiders there, creating a giant ferocious breed that came to be known as the [[Children of Ungoliant]]. They long plauged Middle-Earth, and played notable role in [[The Hobbit]], where they ensnared the party of Dwarves, as well as when [[Frodo]] and [[Samwise Gamgee]] encountered [[Shelob]], last of the Children of Ungoliant, in [[The Two Towers]]. After Shelob died they gruesome race died out.

==List of races==

List of '''races''' that inhabit [[Arda]]

*[[Ainur]]
**[[Valar]]
**[[Maiar]]
***[[Istari]]
*[[Dwarves]]
*[[Elves]]
*[[Ents]]
*[[Men]]
**[[Hobbits]]
*[[Orcs]]
**[[Greater Orcs]]
**[[Uruk-hai]]
**[[Goblins]]
*[[Trolls]]
**[[Cave-trolls]]
**[[Hill trolls]]
**[[Snow trolls]]
**[[Olog-Hai]]

List of '''Beast Races''' known to talk:

*[[Eagles]]
*[[Ravens]]
*[[Wolves]]
**[[Werewolves]]
**[[Wargs]]
*[[Spiders]]

Races

2008-05-22T23:20:37Z

Maeglin: Think this is pretty much complete....I added Spiders to the list already there cause they talk in the hobbit... does anyone think others should be include just because they talk (ie; dragons?)

{{cleanup}}{{stub}}

Many '''races''' inhabit [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]]'s '''legendarium'''. They vary in appearance, intellect, manner and more, but will here be divided into two specific categories: Those who speak, and are thus (for the most part) intelligent, and beasts tat are known to talk.

== Origins ==
Each race has it's origin, and each of those is different. In the beggining there was [[Eru]], [[Iluvatar]], the Creator. He has no beginning according to Tolkien's [[Legendarium]] and so from him come all other races. First he makes [[Ainur]], the holy ones. He prepares to make a creation of [[Elves]], then the [[Men]]. These races are blessed amongst the other races, who primarily come afterwards by other means.

==Ainur==
===Valar===

The [[Valar]] are the first actual race, but do not really take regular appearance in [[Middle Earth]], being considered Gods. They are the dominant Ainur, the other holy beings serving them (with the exception of Eru). They are spiritual form, but do take physical form when they speak to the peoples of [[Arda]]. They live in [[Aman]]. Each Valar have their own purpose, much like the mythological gods of Greece and Rome.

They are as follows:

*[[Manwë]] is the chief of the Valar

*[[Varda]] is the chief goddess of the Valier, Maker of the stars and spouse of Manwë]]

*[[Aule]] is the smith and master of crafts.

*[[Yavanna]] is the Goddess of nature

*[[Vana]] is called the ever young. Spouse of Oromë and sister of Yavanna.

*[[Oromë]], for he is the god of the hunt.

*[[Tulkas]] was greatest of the Valar in strenght and deeds of prowess.

*[[Melkor]], called [[Morgoth]] by the [[Noldor]], he went astray and was jealous of the other valar. Because of this he became the first [[Dark Lord]] and rebelled against the Valar, bringing evil into the world.

*[[Ulmo]], lord of the waters.

*[[Mandos|Námo Mandos]], keeper of death in his famed halls.

*[[Irmo|Irmo Lórien]], lord of dreams

*[[Nienna]]

*[[Estë]]

*[[Vairë]]

*[[Nessa]]

===Maiar===

The [[Maiar]] are lesser Ainur, being servants to the Valar. They are seen more often carrying out tasks in middle earth. Most notable are: [[Sauron]], servant of Melkor, [[Ossë]], servant of Ulmo, [[Melian]], who married the elf, [[Elu Thingol]]. There are many Maia, and certainly more than the valar. Many are noted but some are just counted among the servants of the Valar. Notably among these are the [[Balrogs]], demons of fire, who are possessed with spirits of Maiar.

====Istari====

The [[Istari]] are Maiar, sent by the Valar in the form of Men, or rather [[wizards]], in order to aid the fight against evil. Being Maiar they have extraordinary capabilities, being able to turn the tide of many a battle. Because of their great power there need not be many of them, so there were five. They were led first by [[Saruman]], The White, who headed the order. He later turned to evil and became [[Saruman of Many Colors]], forsaking his position in the order. Replacing him was [[Gandalf]], the Grey, who was later Gandalf, the White, signifying his leadership of the order. It was he who aided the [[Fellowship of the Ring]] in their quest to destroy the [[Ring of Power]], also aiding defenders of [[Minas Tirith]] against Sauron's host, as well as a host of other deeds. The third is [[Radagast]], the Brown, who was renowned for his love of nature and capability of conversing with it, but it is said he was distracted from his course. The last two are eluded to often as the [[Blue Wizards]], whose names were [[Alatar]] and [[Pallando]] when they were in Valinor. It is said they went east and strayed to evil. Their names were then [[Morinehtar]] and [[Rómestámo]], respectively. They are hardly spoken of after they went east. So of all the five Istari, only Gandalf [[Mithrandir]] stayed true to their original duty.

== Elves ==
[[Elves]], called the [[Firstborn]] of Illuvatar, were the first people of middle earth. They were created by Eru and are described generally as tall and fair, but have many specific characteristics. They were placed in middle earth and summoned for a journey to Aman. They are divided by those who refused, those who stopped along the way and those who made it to Aman.

== Men ==

[[Men]] were the secondborn, looking much like Elves but slightly less in stature, and not as fair. They never were accepted in Aman, but for a few special exceptions. They too are separated in loyalty, but still comprise a majority of those who are 'good', and are called [[Edain]]. Evil men include the [[Swarthy men]] or [[Easterlings]]. Later on they developed into more advanced peoples including the men of [[Gondor]] and [[Numenor]], but some remained unsophisticated as those of [[Rohan]] and [[Harad]]. Being second they are cut off in smaller tribes at first, but later the dominion of Men surpasses elves as the leaders of middle-earth.

=== Hobbits===

[[Hobbits]] are an offshoot of men, but rather shorter than the 'Big Folk', as they call them. They have many defining characteristics that make them different from just short men and certainly not dwarves. While their exact origin is unknown, they are known as perhaps an offshoot of men. Not dealing in te affairs of other races they inhabit specific regions. There are several varieties including the Hobbits of the [[Shire]] and the [[Riverfolk]]

== Dwarves ==

The [[Dwarves]] came last of the 'good' peoples, though they are not intrinsically good. They were made by Aulë, who in eagerness to create people of his own, made the Dwarves, despite the fact that he could not inspire life. Because of this he was forced to destroy them, but at the last moment Manwë had pity on them, and so the Dwarves came to existence. Short in stature and hardy, they keep to themselves and are prone to good or evil.

==Ents==

[[Ents]] are Shepherds of the trees, and though looking very much like them are certainly not trees. They stand as humans but tower in the treetops and are covered in foliage. They originally tended the trees in [[Beleriand]] and lived happily with their [[Entwives]]. However, after the new shaping of the world they were lost and the Ents slowly died out.

==Orcs==

[[Orcs]] were originally created by Morgoth as a mockery of the Elves which Eru created. Fearing light they try to remain hidden or are provided for with dark clouts from their master. The making of Orcs was called Morgoth's most despicable act. How they come about is unknown; it is said they were created by tortured elves in Morgoth's dungeons, but how and of what frequency this happened is unknown. They, however, cannot be created of nothing, as only Eru can truly do this. Orcs spread wide as servants of evil. Some worked in manual service, many were warriors- basic troops that could spread fear and evil across the country, and others were wild, bound to evil service but going where they will.

===Greater Orcs===

[[Greater Orcs]] are not spoken much of, excepy in the earlier tales of [[Arda]]. Generally they are stronger and larger than regular orcs.

===Goblins===
[[Goblins]] are a smaller, more wild species of orc. Most of them dwell in caves, such as the infamous subterranean goblins of [[Moria]]. This by all means does not mean Goblins are completely bestial, and indeed were rather organized at times, especially under kings such as [[Azog]]. Additionally, Goblins do not always stay underground, but indeed prefer it as they hate light.

===Uruk-Hai===
[[Uruk-hai]] are a larger breed of orcs made by Saruman after he turned to evil. They are larger and stronger than the average orc as well as more disciplined and intelligent (to certain degree), and probably most importantly they are not afraid of the sun. A cross between men and orc the name Uruk-Hai means 'orc-folk'. They had greater success than their smaller counterpart, but only came towards the end of the [[Third Age]] and Sauron's destruction.

==Troll==

[[Trolls]] were made by Morgoth in mockery of Ents, as orcs were of elves. They are large humanoid creatures that vary in type. Generally trolls too fear the sun and even turn to stone if exposed to it. Made before the first age many went into hiding and reappear in service of Sauron.

===Cave Trolls===

[[Cave-trolls]] are a subterranean variety of troll, seen frequently in Tolkien's writings, particularly in the [[Battle of the Chamber of Mazarbul]]. They areincapable of speech and so are probably not considered an organized race, but none the less are still trolls.

===Hill and Snow Trolls===

[[Hill Trolls|Hill]] and [[Snow Trolls]] are mentioned only a little in Tolkien's works, but none the less do make a presence. Their names give explanation to their appearance and dwelling, but for the most part they are like regular trolls. While they are not spoken of much, they do make prominent appearance in Electronic Art's [[The Battle for Middle-earth II - The Rise of the Witch-king]]

===Olog-Hai===

[[Olog-Hai]] were a larger, stronger and (slightly) more intelligent breed of of troll. Created by Sauron in the third age, their largest advantage to regular trolls perhaps is that they do not turn to stone in daylight. Olog-Hai are to normal trolls as Uruk-Hai are to normal orcs, and they are indeed to be feared.

----
Here follows beasts known to speak:

==Eagles==

The great [[Eagles]] played instumental role in the fight against evil, especially considering how lofty they were and the fact that they were still 'beasts'. These giant Eagles were sent from [[Valinor]] to aid the will of the Valar. This way the Ainur did not become physically involved in the affairs of Middle-Earth, but still could lend aid. This is of course not to say the Eagles would aid Elves and Men on a whim, but would generally only come at most dire need in order to change course of Middle-Earth.

==Ravens==

The [[Ravens]] of Middle-Earth were also of extrodanairy skill, but not in combat. Like the Eagles, they too bore tremendous eyesight and so were exceptional spies and scouts. Unlike Eagles they were not inclined specifically to good or evil, but were used by both. Known masters could be good, such as Radagast the Brown, but could also be Evil, such as when Saruman used the [[Crebain]] of [[Dunland]] to spy on the [[Fellowship]]. A small but useful tool, they could be effective in their own way.

==Wolves==

The [[Wolves]] of Middle-Earth were a fearsome lot. Curious enough, they were all evil while [[Huan]], a domestic hound, was a champion of good. At any rate, the wolves developed over the years into a variety of fearsome beasts, all terrifying.

===Werewolves===

Perhaps the fiercest Wolves of Middle-Earth, the [[Werewolves]] were a groteque creation by Morgoth. Giant Wolves embodied with a tortured spirit, they were some of the fiercest beasts of Morgoth's reign. Famous among them were [[Draugluin]] and [[Carcharoth]], both slain by [[Huan]]. Werewolves faded from the legendarium around the end of the first age, probably destroyed in the [[War of Wrath]].

===Wargs===

[[Wargs]] were a lesser version of their predecessors, created by [[Sauron]], most likely in remaking of the Werewolves which he used to command on [[Tol-in-Gaurhoth]] as [[Gorthaur]]. Many of these Wargs were enlisted as evil steeds, while others ran wild and grew into a large force of wild Wargs, who knew no allegiance, but were still inclined towards evil. They were known to speak, rarely, but in instances, such as those who attacked [[The Fellowship of the Ring]] in the chapter [[The Ring Goes South]].

==Spiders==

The giant [[Spiders]] of Middle-Earth were a widespread evil. They began when [[Ungoliant]], an evil Maiar, took form of spider and aided [[Morgoth]] in destruction of Valinor. She then fled to Middle-Earth and bred amongst the spiders there, creating a giant ferocious breed that came to be known as the [[Children of Ungoliant]]. They long plauged Middle-Earth, and played notable role in [[The Hobbit]], where they ensnared the party of Dwarves, as well as when [[Frodo]] and [[Samwise Gamgee]] encountered [[Shelob]], last of the Children of Ungoliant, in [[The Two Towers]]. After Shelob died they gruesome race died out.

==List of races==

List of '''races''' that inhabit [[Arda]]

*[[Ainur]]
**[[Valar]]
**[[Maiar]]
***[[Istari]]
*[[Dwarves]]
*[[Elves]]
*[[Ents]]
*[[Men]]
**[[Hobbits]]
*[[Orcs]]
**[[Greater Orcs]]
**[[Uruk-hai]]
**[[Goblins]]
*[[Trolls]]
**[[Cave-trolls]]
**[[Hill trolls]]
**[[Snow trolls]]
**[[Olog-Hai]]

List of '''Beast Races''' known to talk:

*[[Eagles]]
*[[Ravens]]
*[[Wolves]]
**[[Werewolves]]
**[[Wargs]]
*[[Spiders]]

Races

2008-05-21T02:43:51Z

Maeglin:

{{cleanup}}{{stub}}

Many '''races''' inhabit [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]]'s '''legendarium'''. They vary in appearence, intellect, manner and more, but will here be divided into two specific catagories: Those who speak, and are thus (for the most part) intelligent, and beasts tat are known to talk.

== Origins ==
Each race has it's origin, and each of those is different. In the beggining there was [[Eru]], [[Iluvatar]], the Creator. He has no beggining according to Tolkien's [[Legendarium]] and so from him come all other races. First he makes [[Ainur]], the holy ones. He prepares to make a creation of [[Elves]], then the [[Men]]. These races are blessed amongst the other races, who primarily come afterwards by other means.

==Ainur==
===Valar===

The [[Valar]] are the first actual race, but do not really take regular appearence in [[Middle Earth]], being considered Gods. They are the dominant Ainur, the other holy beings serving them (with the exception of Eru). They are spiritual form, but do take physical form when they speak to the peoples of [[Arda]]. They live in [[Aman]]. Each Valar have their own purpose,, much ike the mythological gods of Greece and Rome.

They are as follows:

*[[Manwë]] is the chief of the Valar

*[[Varda]] is the chief godess of the Valier, Maker of the stars and spouse of Manwë]]

*[[Aule]] is the smith and master of crafts.

*[[Yavanna]] is the Goddess of nature

*[[Vana]] is called the ever young. Spouse of Oromë and sister of Yavanna.

*[[Oromë]], for he is the god of the hunt.

*[[Tulkas]] was greatest of the Valar in strenght and deeds of prowess.

*[[Melkor]], called [[Morgoth]] by the [[Noldor]], he went astray and was jealous of the other valar. Because of this he became the first [[Dark Lord]] and rebelled against the Valar, bringing evil into the world.

*[[Ulmo]], lord of the waters.

*[[Mandos|Námo Mandos]], keeper of death in his famed halls.

*[[Irmo|Irmo Lórien]], lord of dreams

*[[Nienna]]

*[[Estë]]

*[[Vairë]]

*[[Nessa]]

===Maiar===

The [[Maiar]] are lesser Ainur, being servants to the Valar. They are seen more often carrying out tasks in middle earth. Most notable are: [[Sauron]],servant of Melkor, [[Ossë]], servant of Ulmo, [[Melian]], who married the elf, [[Elu Thingol]]. There are many Maia, and certainly more than the valar. Many are noted but some are just counted among the servants of the Valar. Notably among these are the [[Balrogs]], demons of fire, who are possesed with spirits of Maiar.

====Istari====

The [[Istari]] are Maiar, sent by the Valar in the form of Men, or rather [[wizards]], in order to aid the fight against evil. Being Maiar they have extrodanairy capabilities, being able to turn the tide of many a battle. Because of their great power there need not be many of them, so there were five. They were led first by [[Saruman]], The White, who headed the order. He later turned to evil and became [[Saruman of Many Colors]], forsaking his position in the order. Replacing him was [[Gandalf]], the Grey, who was later Gandalf, the White, signifying his leadership of the order. It was he who aided the [[Fellowship of the Ring]] in their quest to destroy the [[Ring of Power]], also aiding defenders of [[Minas Tirith]] against Sauron's host, as well as a host of other deeds. The third is [[Radagast]], the Brown, who was renowned for his love of nature and capability of conversing with it, but it is said he was distracted from his course. The last two are eluded to often as the [[Blue Wizards]], whose names were [[Alatar]] and [[Pallando]] when they were in Valinor. It is said they went east and strayed to evil. Their names were then [[Morinehtar]] and [[Rómestámo]], respectively. They are hardly spoken of after they went east. So of all the five Istari, only Gandalf [[Mithrandir]] stayed true to their original duty.

== Elves ==
[[Elves]], called the [[Firstborn]] of illuvatar, were the first people of middle earth. They were created by Eru and are described generally as tall and fair, but have many specific characteristics. They were placed in middle earth and summoned for a journey to Aman. They are divided by those who refused, those who stopped along the way and those who made it to Aman.

== Men ==

[[Men]] were te secondborn, looking much like men but slightly less in stature, and not as fair. They never were accepted in aman, but for a few special exceptions. They too are seperated in loyalty, but still comprise a majority of those who are 'good', and are called [[Edain]]. Evil men include the [[Swarthy men]] or [[Easterlings]]. Later on they developed into more advanced peoples including the men of [[Gondor]] and [[Numenor]], but some remained unsophisticated as those of [[Rohan]] and [[Harad]] Being second they are cut off in smaller tribes at first, but later the dominion of men surpasses elves as the leaders of middle- earth.

=== Hobbits===

[[Hobbits]] are an offshoot of men, but rather shorter than the 'Big Folk', as they call them. They have many defining charachteristics that make them different from just short men and certainly not dwarves. While their exact origin is unknown, they are known as perhaps an offshoot of men. Not dealing in te affairs of other races they inhabit specific regions. There are several varieties including the Hobbits of the [[Shire]] and the [[Riverfolk]]

== Dwarves ==

The [[Dwarves]] came last of the 'good' peoples, though they are not intrinsically good. They were made by Aulë, who in eagerness to create people of his own, made the Dwarves, despite the fact that he could not inspire life. Because of this he was forced to destroy them, but at the last moment Manwë had pity on them, and so the Dwaves came to existence. Short in stature and hardy they keep to themselves and are prone to good or evil.

==Ents==

[[Ents]] are Shepherds of the trees, and though looking very much like them are certainly not trees. They stand as humans but tower in the treetops and are covered in foliage. They originally tended the trees in [[Beleriand]] and lived happily with their [[Entwives]]. However, after the new shaping of the world they were lost and the Ents slowly died out.

==Orcs==

[[Orcs]] were originally created by Morgoth as a mockery of the elves which Eru created. Fearing light they try to remain hidden or are provided for with dark clouts from their master. The making of orcs was called Morgoth's most despicable act. How they come about is unknown; it is said they were created by tortured elves in Morgoth's dungeons, but how and of what frequency this happened is unknown. They, however, can not be created of nothing, as only Eru can truly do this. Orcs spread wide as servants of evil. Some worked in manual service, many were warriors- basic troops that could spread fear and evil across the country, and others were wild, bound to evil service but going where they will.

===Greater Orcs===

[[Greater Orcs]] are not spoken much of, excepy in the earlier tales of [[Arda]]. Generally they are stronger and larger than regular orcs.

===Goblins===
[[Goblins]] are a smaller, more wild species of orc. Most of them dwell in caves, such as the infamous subterrainean goblins of [[Moria]]. This by all means does not mean Goblins are completely bestial, and indeed were rather organized at times, especially under kings such as [[Azog]]. Additionally, Goblins do not always stay underground, but indeed prefer it as they hate light.

===Uruk-Hai===
[[Uruk-hai]] are a larger breed of orcs made by Saruman after he turned to evil. They are larger and stronger than the average orc as well as more disciplined and intelligent (to certain degree), and probably most importantly they are not afraid of the sun. A cross between men and orc the name Uruk-Hai means 'orc-folk'. They had greater sucess than their smaller counterpart, but only came towards the end of the [[Third Age]] and Sauron's destruction.

==Troll==

[[Trolls]] were made by Morgoth in mockery of Ents, as orcs were of elves. They are large humanoid creatures that vary in type. Generally trolls too fear the sun and even turn to stone if exposed to it. Made before the first age many went into hiding and reappear in service of Sauron.

===Cave Trolls===

[[Cave-Trolls]] are a subterranean variety of troll, seen frequently in Tolkien's writings, particularly in the [[Battle of the Chamber of Mazarbul]]. They areincapable of speech and so are probably not considered an organized race, but none the less are still trolls.

===Hill and Snow Trolls===

[[Hill Trolls|Hill]] and [[Snow Trolls]] are mentioned only a little in Tolkien's works, but none the less do make a presence. Their names give explanation to their appearence and dwelling, but for the most part they are like regular trolls. While they are not spoken of much, they do make prominent appearence in Electronic Art's [[Battle for Middle-Earth II: Rise of the Witch King]]

===Olog-Hai===

[[Olog-Hai]] were a larger, stronger and (slightly) more intelligent breed of of troll. Created by Sauron in the third age, their largerst advantage to regular trolls perhaps is that they do not turn to stone in daylight. Olog-Hai are to normal trolls as Uruk-Hai are to normal orcs.

==List of races==

List of '''races''' that inhabit [[Arda]]

*[[Ainur]]
**[[Valar]]
**[[Maiar]]
***[[Istari]]
*[[Dwarves]]
*[[Elves]]
*[[Ents]]
*[[Men]]
**[[Hobbits]]
*[[Orcs]]
*[[Trolls]]

List of '''Beast Races''' known to talk:

*[[Eagles]]
*[[Ravens]]
*[[Wargs]]

Races

2008-05-20T02:29:35Z

Maeglin: oops- this is Maeglin again, I forgot 2 log in.

{{cleanup}}{{stub}}

Many '''races''' inhabit [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]]'s '''legendarium'''. They vary in appearence, intellect, manner and more, but will here be divided into two specific catagories: Those who speak, and are thus (for the most part) intelligent, and beasts tat are known to talk.

== Origins ==
Each race has it's origin, and each of those is different. In the beggining there was [[Eru]], [[Iluvatar]], the Creator. He has no beggining according to Tolkien's [[Legendarium]] and so from him come all other races. First he makes [[Ainur]], the holy ones. He prepares to make a creation of [[Elves]], then the [[Men]]. These races are blessed amongst the other races, who primarily come afterwards by other means.

==Ainur==
===Valar===

The [[Valar]] are the first actual race, but do not really take regular appearence in [[Middle Earth]], being considered Gods. They are the dominant Ainur, the other holy beings serving them (with the exception of Eru). They are spiritual form, but do take physical form when they speak to the peoples of [[Arda]]. They live in [[Aman]]. Each Valar have their own purpose,, much ike the mythological gods of Greece and Rome.

They are as follows:

*[[Manwë]] is the chief of the Valar

*[[Varda]] is the chief godess of the Valier, Maker of the stars and spouse of Manwë]]

*[[Aule]] is the smith and master of crafts.

*[[Yavanna]] is the Goddess of nature

*[[Vana]] is called the ever young. Spouse of Oromë and sister of Yavanna.

*[[Oromë]], for he is the god of the hunt.

*[[Tulkas]] was greatest of the Valar in strenght and deeds of prowess.

*[[Melkor]], called [[Morgoth]] by the [[Noldor]], he went astray and was jealous of the other valar. Because of this he became the first [[Dark Lord]] and rebelled against the Valar, bringing evil into the world.

*[[Ulmo]], lord of the waters.

*[[Mandos|Námo Mandos]], keeper of death in his famed halls.

*[[Irmo|Irmo Lórien]], lord of dreams

*[[Nienna]]

*[[Estë]]

*[[Vairë]]

*[[Nessa]]

===Maiar===

The [[Maiar]] are lesser Ainur, being servants to the Valar. They are seen more often carrying out tasks in middle earth. Most notable are: [[Sauron]],servant of Melkor, [[Ossë]], servant of Ulmo, [[Melian]], who married the elf, [[Elu Thingol]]. There are many Maia, and certainly more than the valar. Many are noted but some are just counted among the servants of the Valar. Notably among these are the [[Balrogs]], demons of fire, who are possesed with spirits of Maiar.

====Istari====

The [[Istari]] are Maiar, sent by the Valar in the form of Men, or rather [[wizards]], in order to aid the fight against evil. Being Maiar they have extrodanairy capabilities, being able to turn the tide of many a battle. Because of their great power there need not be many of them, so there were five. They were led first by [[Saruman]], The White, who headed the order. He later turned to evil and became [[Saruman of Many Colors]], forsaking his position in the order. Replacing him was [[Gandalf]], the Grey, who was later Gandalf, the White, signifying his leadership of the order. It was he who aided the [[Fellowship of the Ring]] in their quest to destroy the [[Ring of Power]], also aiding defenders of [[Minas Tirith]] against Sauron's host, as well as a host of other deeds. The third is [[Radagast]], the Brown, who was renowned for his love of nature and capability of conversing with it, but it is said he was distracted from his course. The last two are eluded to often as the [[Blue Wizards]], whose names were [[Alatar]] and [[Pallando]] when they were in Valinor. It is said they went east and strayed to evil. Their names were then [[Morinehtar]] and [[Rómestámo]], respectively. They are hardly spoken of after they went east. So of all the five Istari, only Gandalf [[Mithrandir]] stayed true to their original duty.

== Elves ==
[[Elves]], called the [[Firstborn]] of illuvatar, were the first people of middle earth. They were created by Eru and are described generally as tall and fair, but have many specific characteristics. They were placed in middle earth and summoned for a journey to Aman. They are divided by those who refused, those who stopped along the way and those who made it to Aman.

== Men ==

[[Men]] were te secondborn, looking much like men but slightly less in stature, and not as fair. They never were accepted in aman, but for a few special exceptions. They too are seperated in loyalty, but still comprise a majority of those who are 'good', and are called [[Edain]]. Evil men include the [[Swarthy men]] or [[Easterlings]]. Being second they are cut off in smaller tribes at first, but later the dominion of men surpasses elves as the leaders of middle- earth.

=== Hobbits===

[[Hobbits]] are an offshoot of men, but rather shorter than the 'Big Folk', as they call them. They have many defining charachteristics that make them different from just short men and certainly not dwarves. While their exact origin is unknown, they are known as perhaps an offshoot of men. Not dealing in te affairs of other races they inhabit specific regions. There are several varieties including the Hobbits of the [[Shire]] and the [[Riverfolk]]

== Dwarves ==

The [[Dwarves]] came last of the 'good' peoples, though they are not intrinsically good. They were made by Aulë, who in eagerness to create people of his own, made the Dwarves, despite the fact that he could not inspire life. Because of this he was forced to destroy them, but at the last moment Manwë had pity on them, and so the Dwaves came to existence. Short in stature and hardy they keep to themselves and are prone to good or evil.

==Ents==

[[Ents]] are Shepherds of the trees, and though looking very much like them are certainly not trees. They stand as humans but tower in the treetops and are covered in foliage. They originally tended the trees in [[Beleriand]] and lived happily with their [[Entwives]]. However, after the new shaping of the world they were lost and the Ents slowly died out.

==Orcs==

[[Orcs]] were originally created by Morgoth as a mockery of the elves which Eru created. Fearing light they try to remain hidden or are provided for with dark clouts from their master. The making of orcs was called Morgoth's most despicable act. How they come about is unknown; it is said they were created by tortured elves in Morgoth's dungeons, but how and of what frequency this happened is unknown. They, however, can not be created of nothing, as only Eru can truly do this. Orcs spread wide as servants of evil. Some worked in manual service, many were warriors- basic troops that could spread fear and evil across the country, and others were wild, bound to evil service but going where they will.

===Greater Orcs===

[[Greater Orcs]] are not spoken much of, excepy in the earlier tales of [[Arda]]. Generally they are stronger and larger than regular orcs.

===Goblins===
[[Goblins]] are a smaller, more wild species of orc. Most of them dwell in caves, such as the infamous subterrainean goblins of [[Moria]]. This by all means does not mean Goblins are completely bestial, and indeed were rather organized at times, especially under kings such as [[Azog]]. Additionally, Goblins do not always stay underground, but indeed prefer it as they hate light.

===Uruk-Hai===
[[Uruk-hai]] are a larger breed of orcs made by Saruman after he turned to evil. They are larger and stronger than the average orc as well as more disciplined and intelligent (to certain degree), and probably most importantly they are not afraid of the sun. A cross between men and orc the name Uruk-Hai means 'orc-folk'. They had greater sucess than their smaller counterpart, but only came towards the end of the [[Third Age]] and Sauron's destruction.

==Troll==

[[Trolls]] were made by Morgoth in mockery of Ents, as orcs were of elves. They are large humanoid creatures that vary in type. Generally trolls too fear the sun and even turn to stone if exposed to it. Made before the first age many went into hiding and reappear in service of Sauron.

===Cave Trolls===

[[Cave-Trolls]] are a subterranean variety of troll, seen frequently in Tolkien's writings, particularly in the [[Battle of the Chamber of Mazarbul]]. They areincapable of speech and so are probably not considered an organized race, but none the less are still trolls.

===Hill and Snow Trolls===

[[Hill Trolls|Hill]] and [[Snow Trolls]] are mentioned only a little in Tolkien's works, but none the less do make a presence. Their names give explanation to their appearence and dwelling, but for the most part they are like regular trolls. While they are not spoken of much, they do make prominent appearence in Electronic Art's [[Battle for Middle Earth II: Rise of the Witch King]]

===Olog-Hai===

[[Olog-Hai]]
==List of races==

List of '''races''' that inhabit [[Arda]]

*[[Ainur]]
**[[Valar]]
**[[Maiar]]
***[[Istari]]
*[[Dwarves]]
*[[Elves]]
*[[Ents]]
*[[Men]]
**[[Hobbits]]
*[[Orcs]]
*[[Trolls]]

List of '''Beast Races''' known to talk:

*[[Eagles]]
*[[Ravens]]
*[[Wargs]]

Races

2008-05-19T04:44:52Z

Maeglin: I don't have time 2 fill in all of orc, but u get the idea...

{{cleanup}}{{stub}}

Many '''races''' inhabit [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]]'s '''legendarium'''. They vary in appearence, intellect, manner and more, but will here be divided into two specific catagories: Those who speak, and are thus (for the most part) intelligent, and those that cannot.

== Origins ==
Each race has it's origin, and each of those is different. In the beggining there was [[Eru]], [[Iluvatar]], the Creator. He has no beggining according to Tolkien's [[Legendarium]] and so from him come all other races. First he makes [[Ainur]], the holy ones. He prepares to make a creation of [[Elves]], then the [[Men]]. These races are blessed amongst the other races, who primarily come afterwards by other means.

==Ainur==
===Valar===

The [[Valar]] are the first actual race, but do not really take regular appearence in [[Middle Earth]], being considered Gods. They are the dominant Ainur, the other holy beings serving them (with the exception of Eru). They are spiritual form, but do take physical form when they speak to the peoples of [[Arda]]. They live in [[Aman]]. Each Valar have their own purpose,, much ike the mythological gods of Greece and Rome.

They are as follows:

*[[Manwë]] is the chief of the Valar

*[[Varda]] is the chief godess of the Valier, Maker of the stars and spouse of Manwë]]

*[[Aule]] is the smith and master of crafts.

*[[Yavanna]] is the Goddess of nature

*[[Vana]] is called the ever young. Spouse of Oromë and sister of Yavanna.

*[[Oromë]], for he is the god of the hunt.

*[[Tulkas]] was greatest of the Valar in strenght and deeds of prowess.

*[[Melkor]], called [[Morgoth]] by the [[Noldor]], he went astray and was jealous of the other valar. Because of this he became the first [[Dark Lord]] and rebelled against the Valar, bringing evil into the world.

*[[Ulmo]], lord of the waters.

*[[Mandos|Námo Mandos]], keeper of death in his famed halls.

*[[Irmo|Irmo Lórien]], lord of dreams

*[[Nienna]]

*[[Estë]]

*[[Vairë]]

*[[Nessa]]

===Maiar===

The [[Maiar]] are lesser Ainur, being servants to the Valar. They are seen more often carrying out tasks in middle earth. Most notable are: [[Sauron]],servant of Melkor, [[Ossë]], servant of Ulmo, [[Melian]], who married the elf, [[Elu Thingol]]. There are many Maia, and certainly more than the valar. Many are noted but some are just counted among the servants of the Valar. Notably among these are the [[Balrogs]], demons of fire, who are possesed with spirits of Maiar.

====Istari====

The [[Istari]] are Maiar, sent by the Valar in the form of Men, or rather [[wizards]], in order to aid the fight against evil. Being Maiar they have extrodanairy capabilities, being able to turn the tide of many a battle. Because of their great power there need not be many of them, so there were five. They were led first by [[Saruman]], The White, who headed the order. He later turned to evil and became [[Saruman of Many Colors]], forsaking his position in the order. Replacing him was [[Gandalf]], the Grey, who was later Gandalf, the White, signifying his leadership of the order. It was he who aided the [[Fellowship of the Ring]] in their quest to destroy the [[Ring of Power]], also aiding defenders of [[Minas Tirith]] against Sauron's host, as well as a host of other deeds. The third is [[Radagast]], the Brown, who was renowned for his love of nature and capability of conversing with it, but it is said he was distracted from his course. The last two are eluded to often as the [[Blue Wizards]], whose names were [[Alatar]] and [[Pallando]] when they were in Valinor. It is said they went east and strayed to evil. Their names were then [[Morinehtar]] and [[Rómestámo]], respectively. They are hardly spoken of after they went east. So of all the five Istari, only Gandalf [[Mithrandir]] stayed true to their original duty.

== Elves ==
[[Elves]], called the [[Firstborn]] of illuvatar, were the first people of middle earth. They were created by Eru and are described generally as tall and fair, but have many specific characteristics. They were placed in middle earth and summoned for a journey to Aman. They are divided by those who refused, those who stopped along the way and those who made it to Aman.

== Men ==

[[Men]] were te secondborn, looking much like men but slightly less in stature, and not as fair. They never were accepted in aman, but for a few special exceptions. They too are seperated in loyalty, but still comprise a majority of those who are 'good', and are called [[Edain]]. Evil men include the [[Swarthy men]] or [[Easterlings]]. Being second they are cut off in smaller tribes at first, but later the dominion of men surpasses elves as the leaders of middle- earth.

=== Hobbits===

[[Hobbits]] are an offshoot of men, but rather shorter than the 'Big Folk', as they call them. They have many defining charachteristics that make them different from just short men and certainly not dwarves. While their exact origin is unknown, they are known as perhaps an offshoot of men. Not dealing in te affairs of other races they inhabit specific regions. There are several varieties including the Hobbits of the [[Shire]] and the [[Riverfolk]]

== Dwarves ==

The [[Dwarves]] came last of the 'good' peoples, though they are not intrinsically good. They were made by Aulë, who in eagerness to create people of his own, made the Dwarves, despite the fact that he could not inspire life. Because of this he was forced to destroy them, but at the last moment Manwë had pity on them, and so the Dwaves came to existence. Short in stature and hardy they keep to themselves and are prone to good or evil.

==Ents==

[[Ents]] are Shepherds of the trees, and though looking very much like them are certainly not trees. They stand as humans but tower in the treetops and are covered in foliage. They originally tended the trees in [[Beleriand]] and lived happily with their [[Entwives]]. However, after the new shaping of the world they were lost and the Ents slowly died out.

==Orcs==

[[Orcs]] were originally created by Morgoth as a mockery of the elves which Eru created. This was called Morgoth's most despicable act. How they come about is unknown; it is said they were created by tortured elves in Morgoth's dungeons, but how and of what frequency this happened is unknown. They, however, can not be created of nothing, as only Eru can truly do this. Orcs spread wide as servants of evil. Some worked in manual service, many were warriors- basic troops that could spread fear and evil across the country, and others were wild, bound to evil service but going where they will.

===Greater Orcs===

[[Greater Orcs]] are spoken much of, especially in the earlier tales of [[Arda]]

===Goblins===
[[Goblins]]

===Uruk-Hai===
[[Uruk-hai]]

==List of races==

List of '''races''' that inhabit [[Arda]]

*[[Ainur]]
**[[Valar]]
**[[Maiar]]
***[[Istari]]
*[[Dwarves]]
*[[Elves]]
*[[Ents]]
*[[Men]]
**[[Hobbits]]
*[[Orcs]]
*[[Trolls]]

List of '''Beast Races''' known to talk:

*[[Eagles]]
*[[Ravens]]
*[[Wargs]]

Races

2008-05-19T03:41:16Z

Maeglin:

Races

2008-05-19T03:35:14Z

Maeglin: just adding another race....

Races

2008-05-17T04:44:09Z

Maeglin:

{{cleanup}}

Many '''races''' inhabit Tolkien's '''legendarium'''. They vary in appearence, intellect, manner and more, but will here be divided into two specific catagories: Those who speak, and are thus (for the most part) intelligent, and those that cannot.

== Origins ==
Each race has it's origin, and each of those is different. In the beggining there was [[Eru]], [[Iluvatar]], the Creator. He has no beggining according to Tolkien's [[Legendarium]] and so from him come all other races. First he makes [[Ainur]], the holy ones. He prepares to make a creation of [[Elves]], then the [[Men]]. These races are blessed amongst the other races, who primarily come afterwards by other means.

== Valar ==

The Valar are the first actual race, but do not really take regular appearence in [[Middle Earth]], being considered Gods. They are the dominant Ainur, the other holy beings serving them (with the exception of Eru). They are spiritual form, but do take physical form when they speak to the peoples of [[Arda]]. They live in [[Aman]]. Each Valar have their own purpose,, much ike the mythological gods of Greece and Rome.

They are as follows:

*[[Manwë]]is the chief of the Valar

*[[Varda]] is the chief godess of the Valier, Maker of the stars and spouse of Manwë]]

*[[Aule]] is the smith and master of crafts.

*[[Yavanna]] is the Goddess of nature

*[[Vana]] is called the ever young. Spouse of Oromë and sister of Yavanna.

*[[Oromë]], means horn-blower, for he is the god of the hunt.

*[[Tulkas]] was greatest of the Valar in strenght and deeds of prowess.

*[[Melkor]], called [[Morgoth]] by the [[Noldor]], he went astray and was jealous of the other valar. Because of this he became the first [[Dark Lord]] and rebelled against the Valar, bringing evil into the world.

*[[Ulmo]], lord of the waters.

*[[Mandos]], keeper of death in his famed halls.

*[[Lorien]]

*[[Nienna]]

*[[Este]]

*[[Este]]

*[[Vaire]]

*[[Nessa]]

== Maiar ==

The [[Maiar]] are lesser Ainur, being servants to the Valar. They are seen more often carrying out tasks in middle earth. Most notable are: [[Sauron]],servant of Melkor, [[Ossë]], servant of Ulmo, [[Melian]], who married the elf, [[Thingol]]. There are many Maia, and certainly more than the valar. Many are noted but some are just counted among the servants of the Valar. Notably among these are the [[Balrog]]s, demons of fire, who are possesed with spirits of Maiar.

== Elves ==
[[Elves]], called the [[Firstborn]] of illuvatar, were the first people of middle earth. They were created by Eru and are described generally as tall and fair, but have many specific characteristics. They were placed in middle earth and summoned for a journey to Aman. They are divided by those who refused, those who stopped along the way and those who made it to Aman.

== Men ==

[[Men]] were te secondborn, looking much like men but slightly less in stature, and not as fair. They never were accepted in aman, but for a few special exceptions. They too are seperated in loyalty, but still comprise a majority of those who are 'good', and are called [[Edain]], singular [[Adan]]. Evil men include the [[Swarthy men]] or [[Easterlings]]. Being second they are cut off in smaller tribes at first, but later the dominion of men surpasses elves as the leaders of middle- earth.

== Dwarves ==

The [[Dwarves]] came last of the 'good' peoples, though they are not intrinsicly good. They were made by Aulë, who in eagerness to create people of his own, made the Dwarves, despite the fact that he could not inspire life. Because of this he was forced to destroy them, but at the last moment Manwe had pity on them, and so the Dwaves came to existence. Short in stature and hardy they keep to themselves and are prone to good or evil.

== Headline text ==

List of '''races''' that inhabit [[Middle-earth]]

*[[Dwarves]]
*[[Elves]]
*[[Ents]]
*[[Hobbits]]
*[[Istari]]
*[[Maiar]]
*[[Men]]
*[[Orcs]]
*[[Trolls]]
*[[Valar]]

List of '''Beast Races''' known to talk

*[[Eagles]]
*[[Ravens]]
*[[Wargs]]
{{stub}}

Vanyar

2008-05-17T03:16:01Z

Maeglin:

{{expansion}}
{{race
|image=[[Image:Jenny Dolfen - Fields of Gold.jpg|300px]]
|name=Vanyar.
|dominions=[[Oiolossë]]
|languages=Vanyarin [[Quenya]]
|height=Tall
|length=
|skincolor=Pale
|haircolor=Golden
|feathers=
|distinctions=Most revered of the [[Elves|Elven]] kindreds, loved by [[Manwë]].
|lifespan=Immortal.
|members=[[Ingwë]], [[Indis]], [[Elemmírë (Elf)|Elemmírë]], [[Amarië]], and others.
}}

The '''Vanyar''' are one of the three groups of [[High Elves]], along with the [[Noldor]], and some of the [[Teleri]]. They comprise most of those who did not leave Aman.

== Origins ==

The Vanyar are the highest of the High Elves. According to legend, the clan was founded by [[Imin]], the first [[Elf]] to awake in [[Cuiviénen]], his wife Iminyë, and their twelve companions. However it was [[Ingwë]], the first Vanya to travel with [[Oromë]] to [[Valinor]], who became their king.

Ingwë is called ''High King of the Elves''. He lives on [[Mount Taniquetil]] beneath the halls of [[Manwë]]. All of the Vanyar journeyed to [[Valinor]] before the beginning of the [[First Age]], and remained there. They are said to have the greatest skill in poetry of all the Elves, and Manwë loves them for it.

Another notable Vanya was [[Indis]], the second wife of [[Finwë]] and grandmother of [[Galadriel]]. It is from her Vanyarin blood that Galadriel gained her famous silver-gold hair.

== Description ==

The Vanyar were the first and smallest clan of the Elves. They typically had blonde hair. Few of them were ever seen in [[Middle-earth]], as they only returned for the [[War of Wrath]].

The name ''Vanyar'' means "the Fair" in [[Quenya]], referring to their golden hair. The Vanyar called themselves '''''Minyar''''', "the Firsts", their ancient name.

== Other Versions of the Legendarium ==
In the earliest versions of [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien's]] [[legendarium]] (see: ''[[The Book of Lost Tales 1]]''), they were called '''''Teleri''''', while the Elves known as [[Teleri]] in the published version of ''[[The Silmarillion]]'' were called ''Solosimpi''.

[[Category:High Elves]]
[[Category:Vanyar]]

User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/Fall of Gondolin

2008-05-17T02:22:01Z

Maeglin: /* New script additions */

Greetings! This is the screenplay for Tolkien's epic story, ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]''. The title "''Fall of Gondolin''" may or may not be kept. We may start the script either with [[Tuor]], or with [[Turgon]]'s building of [[Gondolin]], or with a certain "fictional" character who sees Turgon. Unlike the [[Lay of Leithian]] or the [[Narn i Chîn Húrin]], it is possible to insert a "fictional" character, that is one the writers made up, to put the story into more "story-like" form. The other option would be to center on Tuor himself.

As far as my own ideas for the general style of the production go, I believe this production would do well with a sort of poetic style. That is, a heavy emphasis on music and landscape, for instance. Also, the world will be revealed through Tuor's eyes; we see Gondolin for the first time at the same time he does, for instance. Discuss this screenplay below, and feel free to challenge anything if you see fit. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]]

==General Discussion==
General discussion below this line.

== Maeglin vs. Tuor ==

For me the fall of gondolin rotates around the Turgon's obstiance, Tuor's family and Maeglin and Tuor's rivalry. It may be just me, but I wonder if for dramatic purposes it would be good to make Tuor vs. Maeglin a climactic fight(and probably a little later in the battle) rather than Tuor flinging Maeglin off a cliff first thing. Could this be good? (I have figured how this would work, considering a few technicalities.)

==New script additions==

I have written a rather large chunk of the script going up to the beggining of the battle, and I am posting it in chunks, especially since I am converting it to the proper format. I know this is a lot of script, much of it will probably be unneccescary so I wanted to add a couple notes.

First of all, please edit it (of course). I pretty much took the policy o more rather than less so there will probably be some uneccescary stuff (namely the large part I have already posted on Maeglin). I really don't mind whatever you switch. There may be a couple parts of sentmental attatchent tha I thinkre important, but really fee free to shang it around (that's what this is for!)

additionally, I'm not sure how specific I should be with direction, etc. so if I am unclear let me know and I will clarify it.

I think that's all I can think of for this segment, I will be posting other segments quickly as possible.

OK....just added another chunk. Again, much of it probably isn't the best diolouge, so do what you want with it. I have 2 quick notes.

-Here I want to emphasize the romance between Tuor and Idril, that after all these years they still love eachother. I think Tolkien makes this stand out so it should here as well. It might appear to be a little over the top, so there's something to look at.

-Also I include a few changes in things such as Idril's dream. originally she dreams Maeglin does all of this, but I cut that and made it anonymous so the audience could figure it out. I made a couple changes like that, but if you like the purism just change it back. that's pretty much it.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 22:22, 16 May 2008 (EDT)

==Lords of Gondolin==

Should there be a scene (Such as a meeting) that would introduce the lords of gondolin systematically (as well as a couple integral names) to clarify things? Or would that complicate it- people that don't get it don't need to.

I think this also ties in with a couple general questions- is it better on the whole to add more and thus make it longer? Is it better to go into more detail?

== Maeglin subplot ==

Would it be worth it to add a minor subplot concerning Maeglin's upbringing? It would probably only be a few minutes and could intertwine with Tuor's youth, perhaps. Does that sound reasonable or am I just being irrational because I like Maeglin(thus my username)? At any rate I think it would be worth mentioning his past in order to set up his role.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 22:44, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

:Personally, I would prefer that the audience see Gondolin revealed through Tuor's eyes. I think a few brief flashbacks would be good as Maeglin's character is developed, but in my opinion there's no need to show bits of Maeglin's story alongside Tuor's. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:56, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

===Galdor's name===

Should we change Galdor's name? Because of how early in the legendarium he appears I should think it to be forgivable. The point is that I don't want people confusing Tuor's grandfather with this elf-lord (nor do I think Tolkien would, if he had ever rewritten the tale). In one scene I wrote Tuor as saying, "I am Tuor, son of Huor, son of Galdor, son of Hador." Galdor the elf-lord is a minor character, but he does appear at least once by name. A simple solution would be to just have Tuor say, "I am Tuor son of Huor, descendant of Hador." Or, we could change Galdor's name to something else (or even replace Galdor's role altogether with an "invented" character). What are your opinions? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:27, 21 December 2007 (EST)

:I kind of like the idea of just not mentioning his name, it doesn't confuse people and yet it doesn't go against what Tolkien wrote. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 12:04, 21 December 2007 (EST)

===Title Ideas===

* The White Citadel
* Gondolin
* The Hidden Rock/ Secrect City
* Plain old 'The Fall of Gondolin'?

==Questions/suggestions/comments==

===Scenes===

Synopsises below. You may add on ideas as you wish, directly after the synopsises under their own heading.

====One====
The prologue scene; in this scene, [[Ulmo]] will do a voiceover as [[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]] places the armor in [[Vinyamar]]. Ulmo should introduce Turgon's calling to Gondolin, and the promise of a messenger to herald the end. Turgon's face should be hidden during the entirety of this scene, either hooded or merely not shown directly.

====Two====
In this scene [[Tuor]] should escape from the [[Easterlings]], introducing his lineage and the position of [[Men]].

====Three====
Here Tuor heads west, coming to [[Belegaer]]. He will eventually be whispered-to by a gull, a sort of messenger from Ulmo, and head south to Vinyamar. There he enters and discovers the armor, putting it on.

====Four====
In this scene Tuor exits Vinyamar to stand on the sands in front. As he does so, he spies storm-clouds westward over the sea, and hears thunder. Ulmo appears in all his majesty, with his horns calling, and charges him with a mission.

====Five====

==Conceptual Design==
Below shall be discussion for Conceptual Design, and below the discussion conceptual drawings.

Leitmotif code: Each normal letter signifies a quarter note, with ","s to seperate them into beats. "+" or "-" are added to show whether the following note is the one above or below it; a double of either of these shows that it is that note plus and octave. If there is a "/" between two regular notes, that shows both notes to be eighth-notes; double "/" shows them to be sixteenth, and so on. Half-notes are denoted when italicized, and whole notes when boldened. A connecting slur is denoted by "_", while a dot is ".". See below the example:

"Mary had a little lamb": E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, ''E'', -D, D, ''D'', +E, +G, ''G'', -E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, E, E, -D, D, +E, -D, '''-C'''.

===Persons===
====[[Tuor]]====
Tuor should be a rough-looking sort of man to begin with, but at the same time tall and lordly. Rather like the description of [[Aragorn II|Aragorn]], yet not quite so rugged and "in-tune" with the wild. He should always show a certain cleanliness, even when in the wilderness. After he enters Gondolin, he should be always dressed simply, generally in white and blue.

His leitmotif is somewhat wild and free, a little rustic, but tuneful. It also has a solid, low subtone that suggests nobility or royalty. Ideal instruments would be violin, harp, and/or whistle.

====[[Idril]]====
Idril generally wears, like her father, white and red, though occasionally blue and silver can be found in her outfits. Her hair is long and golden, reaching below her waist, often crowned with golden leaves or with a braid.

Idril's leitmotif is high but soft, probably in flutes, whistles, and/or a solo singer. It is probably the most romantic theme, yet not overly so. It remains soft and simple, without being rich and reinforced by a host of other instruments. Best compared to the [http://www.amazon.com/Braveheart-Original-Motion-Picture-Soundtrack/dp/B000004286/sr=8-1/qid=1165590369/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-5960899-5574333?ie=UTF8&s=music theme to Mel Gibson's ''Braveheart'' (see samples for tracks 2-4)].

====[[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]]====
Turgon is very tall and proud, grave of face; reflective and wise. Like his people, his garments are simple, though fine. He is often found in silver-gray or white, and his silver crown contains large red garnets. In great ceremonies he wears red and white, embroidered with gold, carrying a staff carved of white wood, with a gull carved on the end.

His leitmotif is very sturdy and regal. It relies much upon brass, perhaps French Horns or trumpets, playing slowly and solemnly. It also has a distinct tinge of sadness or wistfulness.

Idea leitmotif (3/4): E, ''+A'', +B, ''+C'', -A/+B, +C, +D. /-C, -B, -G, -D, ''+E'', +F#, ''+G'', +A/-G, -F#. /-E, -D, ''+E''

====[[Voronwë of Gondolin|Voronwë]]====

In the beginning Voronwë is dressed in simple gray; a loose tunic and brown belt. Later he wears blue and silver, but always somewhat simply, without jewelry and always loosely.

Voronwë's leitmotif is played ideally on pipes or harps, like the Sea theme but lower. It is wild and quiet, somewhat simple as well, with a tinge of wistfulness.

====[[Ulmo]]====

Ulmo appears as he is described, very strong, in shining mail. Despite his even bearing, he has a bit of wildness about him.

His theme, too, is similar to both the Valinor and Sea themes. It is a combination of whistles in a high, churning melody, and low, sweet strings and horns in a slow, regal and beautiful theme.

====Lords of Gondolin====

[[Glorfindel]] is light-hearted, but very powerful and fiery. [[Ecthelion of the Fountain|Ecthelion]] is more stoic, with quiet emotion and a cold but steady sword-arm. [[Rog]] is misshapen, and it is suggested that he was once tortured by Morgoth; he has a fierce hate of evil, and a love of his art of smithing. All others feature only as minor: [[Egalmoth]] and [[Galdor of the Tree|Galdor]] appear several times with speaking roles, [[Penlod]], [[Duilin of Gondolin|Duilin]], and possibly [[Salgant]] are relegated to a non-speaking (except possibly for several short phrases) background role.

Glorfindel's leitmotif would be played on the woodwinds; high and noble, but seeming never to be still, always active. Ecthelion's is more horns and flutes, a regal, tuneful theme with a tinge of sadness and solemnity. Rog's is deep, with drums and a suggestion of darkness and great anger.

:Rog leitmotif idea (bass clef): A, +C, -Bb, +E, -D, +E, -C, +D#, -A, +B
:Glorfindel leitmotif idea (upper clef, high register; steady A below): E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/-E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/+E/-C/-A/-E/E/+A, C

====[[Maeglin]]====

Maeglin is generally dressed in black embroidered with silver, never excessively ornamented. He should be handsome and dark-haired, but with a somewhat rough voice.

His leitmotif can be played either quick or slow depending on the situation. It is, in its way, beautiful; played either minor or major, with occasional twists and surprise movements, but steady. Possible instruments would be strings or woodwinds.

====Inhabitants of [[Gondolin]]====
In Gondolin it is accepted that weapons are not generally openly displayed, except for guards on duty or during special ceremonies. Men wear Roman-like tunics, but often longer and more robe-like. Women typically have long dresses similar to those in fashion in Medieval Europe in the 14th century, but looser and lighter of material. In ceremonies of importance both their robes are still simple (no elaborate layers decked with gems or anything like that), but embroidered with gold, silver, and other colors. Soldiers wear surcoats bearing the emblem of their house, beneath which is fish-scale mail.

===Places===
====[[Dor-Lómin]]====

Scandinavia.

====[[Gondolin]]====
Idea leitmotif (4/4): A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/-D, +F, -E, A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/+G, -F#, -D

=====[[Square of the King]]=====

A four-sided area on a raised portion near the center of the City of Gondolin. On the far side is the great white palace of King Turgon, with the high tower spiraling up from its center. On either side of the bronze doors of the palace is a tree, one of gold and one of silver ([[Glingal]] and [[Belthil]]). The space of their branches is great enough that a score of elves could sit in each of their boughs, and they are filled with many singing white birds. In the middle of the courtyard, however, is the main attraction: a great fountain, formed by a natural geyser coming from the earth. It shoots up twenty-seven fathoms in the air, seeming to be made of crystal rain. The courtyard is bordered by a low wall of white stone, from which one could look out on the whole city, and just inside the walls by many beautiful green trees, though far smaller in stature than Glingal and Belthil.

=====[[Square of the Folkwell]] (Gardens)=====

A place of light and beauty. The ground is laid by smooth white stone like marble, and great trees grow about them. The roots of the trees are planted each in a raised area of green, grassy earth, which are close enough together that the sunlight comes down in shafts through the branches. Each of the circles is about fourteen cubits in diameter. Some of the mallorns have buildings in their high bows. The trees form a sort of ring around the Folkwell, which is fully two fathoms across and nine fathoms deep clear. It is fed by a spring down at the bottom, and the excess water is piped off to feed the trees of the Square.

=====Hall of the Chronicle=====

Not found in Tolkien's works. The hall is long and white, with a high ceiling. Windows are found just below the ceiling, on a clerestory. The paintings of the history are unbroken, one painting shifting into the other, in bright colors of blue, red, gold, silver, etc., very much in the romantic style.

=====[[Gar Ainion]]=====

A place, again, of light and beauty, with an ephasis on gold, white, and green. It is regular in shape, with arches leaving it open to the winds. Trees grow around it, especially mallorns. Its stone is white and laced with vines, inlaid with intricate gold engravings of leaves and scenes of hunts and bliss in Valinor.

====[[Firth of Drengist]]====
Ideal filming locations would be Cathedral Caves in New Zealand or Cape Cove in Oregon. Both are very different, so it's one or the other. The description in ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]'' is of trees, white sands, and great cliffs beset with caverns and spoutholes.

====[[Vinyamar]]====

==References==
*[[The Fall of Gondolin]], [[Book of Lost Tales 2]]
*[[The Silmarillion]]
*[[Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin]]
__NOTOC__

User:Amroth/Screenplays/Fall of Gondolin

2008-05-17T02:10:18Z

Maeglin:

The '''Fall of Gondolin''' screenplay is an attempt to turn [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]]'s ''The [[Fall of Gondolin]]'' into a film script. The Fall of [[Gondolin]] is, next to the story of [[Beren Erchamion|Beren]] and [[Lúthien]] (''see [[Lay of Leithian screenplay]]'') and possibly the [[Narn i Chîn Húrin]] (''see [[Narn i Chîn Húrin screenplay]]''), considered the most adaptable of Tolkien's writings to screen. This project will also cover the coming of [[Tuor]]. To aide in this project, see the [[Talk:Fall of Gondolin screenplay|Talk page]] above.

==Dramatis Personae==

<poem>
'''TUOR (TUOR)''' – a young man, looking noble but slightly wild
'''IDRIL (IDR.)''' – an elf maiden, appearance of youth, long golden hair
'''TURGON (TUR.)''' – an elf-king, tall, proud, regally dressed but not glamorously
'''ULMO (ULMO)''' – a Vala, tall, blue-green, reflecting the properties of the Sea
'''VORONWË (VOR.)''' – an elf-mariner, quiet, reflective, and yet a touch of youth
'''EÄRENDIL, young (EDL.)''' – a young boy, appearing between five and ten
'''EÄRENDIL, older (EDL, E)''' – a handsome young man, yet solemn of face
'''ECTHELION (ECT.)''' – a tall, brave, but stern elf-lord
'''GLORFINDEL (GFD.)''' – a brave, golden-haired, merry elf-lord
'''ROG (ROG)''' – a misshapen, scarred elf; good-hearted
'''GALDOR (GAL.)''' – a cheerful but fierce elf-lord
'''DUILIN (DLN.)''' - a tall, thin, athletic elf-lord
'''MAEGLIN (MAG.)''' – a young, ambitious but somewhat cold elf
'''EGALMOTH (EGM.)''' – tall, handsome, fiery elf-lord
'''LORGAN (LOR.)''' – Cruel Easterling captain
'''WHIP-MASTER (WHM.)''' – Easterling slave-driver

BLACK SCREEN

DOORS OPEN DIRECTLY AHEAD, letting in WHITE LIGHT… TURGON IS FRAMED IN DOORWAY OF VINYAMAR

'''ULMO (VO)''' Thou hast found thy exile, Turgon King.

TURGON (face hidden) LEANS over TABLET to place down ARMOR upon it, one piece at a time.

'''ULMO (VO)''' The Noldor forsook their land of happiness. Even now thou must flee the realms of the West, and come to the place to which I will bring thee. Morgoth shall search for thee.

TURGON moves his hand over FISH-MAIL.

'''ULMO (VO)''' But he shall not find thee, until I send my messenger to thee. He shall wear this armor which thou art to put to rest in the halls of Vinyamar. Thou shalt build a city in hiding, greater than any other city wrought by the hands of the Elves.

TURGON TURNS away to leave, heading for the DOORS OF VINYAMAR.

'''ULMO (VO)''' Thou shalt call it Gondolin.

DOORS OF VINYAMAR CLOSE, SCREEN GOES BLACK

MUSIC STARTS. FADE IN image of MOUNTAINS OF MITHRIM

SUPER: THE WHITE CITADEL: The Fall of Gondolin

EAGLE PASSES OVERHEAD, ANGLE BELOW to EASTERLING ENCAMPMENT

'''WHM''' [''Walking through camp, SHIFT to inside tent, flap opens to let WHM enter''] You there, the Master wants you, now.

TUOR YAWNS, RISES from BED BESIDE DOGS, and FOLLOWS WHIP-MASTER through CAMP to LORGAN’S TENT. SHIFT to inside TENT, where LORGAN SITS at DESK with AIDE. ENTER WHM and TUOR

'''LOR''' Ah, there you are, slave. Whip-master, leave us.

WHIP-MASTER BOWS and EXITS.

'''LOR''' I have been informed of your conduct. You are taller and stronger than the other slaves. I treat those well who can work. You are of the royal house of the thrice-accursed strawhead Hador, are you not?

'''TUOR''' I am, master.

'''LOR''' You were captured three years ago in the company of the outlaws. They say you slew half a dozen of my soldiers before they could disarm you. You and six others were brought here, and I gave you the hardest work. Four of you died, but you and one other survived. Even my Whip-master can give no complaint as to your conduct. I have lightened your load, for I want you to survive. You were only a boy when you are captured, and now I have never had such a worker as you. Therefore I am sending you west with the working crew into the forest. The reason I tell you this is because I want you to be the overseer.

'''TUOR''' I, master?

'''LOR''' I am a generous and benevolent man. I do this for the timber, not to punish. The other slaves trust you, this I know. I believe they shall work twice as fast under your leadership. I am, of course, sending along the usual guard, and you will be under the jurisdiction of the captain. Do well on this assignment, and I shall grant you better next time. You may go.

'''TUOR''' Thank you, master!

TUOR BOWS and EXITS. A PAUSE.

'''AIDE''' Are you sure this is wise, Lord Lorgan? He is a hard worker. The King cannot touch us out here.

'''LOR''' You would be surprised what the King can do. [''Lifts up a piece of parchment''] The King of the North has sent me a message. Word has come to his ears that one of Hador’s house still exists, in my care. He demands that I send the slave to him, or else dispose of him quickly and quietly. I agree that he has been of great profit to us. But I shall do as the King bids. I will not send the slave to him, but kill him myself. He shall not return from this mission, nor his companion. The Whip-master will do his work thoroughly.

'''AIDE''' Why not kill him here?

'''LOR''' Because, you fool, it might start a slave revolt. No, it is much safer out in the wilderness, and more sure of success.

SHIFT TO TUOR WALKING through CAMP. ANNAEL JOINS HIM.

'''ANL''' Tuor, why did Lorgan want to see you?

'''TUOR''' He is having me oversee a mission in the west to gather timber. I thought I could get him to trust me.

'''ANL''' I don’t like it, my son. Lorgan surely knows you are a threat to him.

'''TUOR''' A threat, master Annael! How could I be a threat to one of the greatest lords of the Easterlings?

'''ANL''' Because you are the symbol of the hope of Dor-Lómin! We two alone have survived from the original band. To him I am just an old man with some work left in me. But you are young and strong, and though you have acted submissive these three winters, he must know that you cannot be trusted.

'''TUOR''' He is a fool not to. Don’t you see that this is our chance to escape? You’ll surely also be put on the work team, and we can escape together.

'''ANL''' Too risky. Even if he does trust you, he’ll surely put a strict guard around you. We need more time.

'''TUOR''' You raised me to be proud. You were the chief of the outlaws, men who would not submit to the Easterlings after my father died and Dor-Lómin fell. You fostered me. You told me about the hope in the south, and of the Valar and the sea. You told me never to lose hope, never to submit to the invader. I believe our time must surely have come.

SHIFT TO SCENES OF TEAM WALKING through the woods. SHIFT TO SLAVES CHOPPING down trees, TREE FALLING. SHIFT TO TUOR CHOPPING FALLEN TRUNK. ANNAEL COMES UP WITH WOOD IN ARMS.

'''ANL''' The guards seem more watchful than usual.

'''TUOR''' Well they should be. [''Chops''] Even the Easterlings could not find us if we disappeared into the forest, without dogs. But it is too risky. They are all armed with bows and javelins.

'''ANL''' Have you noticed how we two are the only ones not off cutting down trees? All my senses revolt at this. Be wary.

ANNAEL MOVES ON. TUOR CONTINUES TO CHOP. SHIFT TIME. TUOR PICKS UP cut logs and WALKS toward wagon. SUDDENLY SEES EASTERLING lift up JAVELIN and HURL it at ANNAEL. TUOR SHOUTS, ANNAEL TURNS and receives the javelin in his side.

'''TUOR''' No!

TUOR LIFTS UP AXE, dropping logs, and ATTACKS EASTERLINGS. BATTLE ENSUES. TUOR KILLS EASTERLINGS, but WHIP-MASTER ENTERS. BATTLE ENSUES. TUOR KILLS WHIP-MASTER, and DROPS down beside ANNAEL.

'''TUOR''' Annael, get up.

'''ANL''' No, Tuor son of Huor, I cannot. This javelin shall be the death of me, I fear. Run while you can. Others will come.

'''TUOR''' I shall take you with me.

'''ANL''' No! Even as you have trusted me in life, you must trust me now. With me you will not get far. You must go now. [Begins to breath more labored] Remember, my son, there is a King in Gondolin.

ANNAEL DIES. TUOR STARES SHOCKED for a moment, then TURNS TO SEE EASTERLINGS approach. Angrily, TUOR CATCHES UP AXE. ARROWS WHISTLE BY, and TUOR FLEES into woods.

'''ETL1''' After him! Don’t let him escape! Bring out the dogs.

SHIFT TO TUOR RUNNING through woods. HEAR DOG SOUNDS FAR AWAY. TUOR ENTERS CLEAR, ROCKY HILL and RUNS UP. As he nears the top, DOGS come forth from TREELINE and pursue. EASTERLINGS COME FORTH and HALT THERE, PANTING.

'''ETL2''' Sir, I cannot run any longer!

'''ETL1''' We’ll wait here. The dogs will run him aground. The little white demon!

TUOR HALTS AT TOP OF HILL, panting heavily. DOGS APPROACH, AND LEAP ON HIM.

'''TUOR''' Urmald, Orgrin, all of you, get down!

DOGS WAG TONGUES, and look at him.

'''TUOR''' You are wise beasts, and the only ones I shall miss in leaving my life as a slave. Return to the camp! Go home!

DOGS BARK and EXIT. TUOR WATCHES, then EXITS. SCREEN FADES IN, revealing TUOR as rugged OUTLAW, walking out of CAVE and into FOREST with BOW.

IMAGE: TUOR SHOOTING down a group of four EASTERLINGS, then approaching to take their packs and eat what food is in them. Suddenly TUOR RAISES HEAD. HE TURNS to see two ELVES walk forward toward him.

'''CDH''' Hail, Tuor son of Huor!

'''TUOR''' Caladharn! Long has it been since I heard the sound of your voice.

TUOR RISES AND EMBRACES CALADHARN.

'''CDH''' I come from Círdan, Lord of Balar. We have a ship in the Firth. We had heard of the destruction of the outlaws, and feared for your life. We were sent to search for you, to bring you south to the Havens of Sirion, where you will be safe. Our search has been long, but at last we have found you. You may escape this land.

'''TUOR''' Caladharn, I have known you since childhood. You remember that before my mother went southward never to return. after the death of my father in battle, she begged that I, then an infant, should stay in Dor-Lómin, and that great good would come of it. Dor-Lómin was overrun, but still Annael kept me safe in the Caves. Now even the Caves are gone, and I am a wanderer. Yet still this is the land of my father still, and I will ever stay here to avenge myself and Annael on these marauding men of the East.

'''CDH''' Tuor, surely you know that you cannot stay here forever. The life of an outlaw is risky, and one day you shall be caught and killed, or worse sent to the Dark Enemy himself. Lorgan is hunting for you. Please, my friend, come with us. Círdan’s power is still great, and he will keep you safe though all Beleriand crumble about you.

'''TUOR''' I will not do it. I’m afraid your mission has been in vain.

'''CDH''' Very well. But this may be the only chance you ever get. I can leave you only with this counsel: if need is dire, go west. There is a secret tunnel through the mountains called the Gate of the Noldor, along the stream we call Mithalag. Follow it, and it will take you to the Western Sea. Is there naught else I may do for you, my friend?

'''TUOR''' Only tell the Lord Círdan, wisest of the Elves, that Huor’s son still lives, and one day he shall avenge his father against Morgoth.

'''CDH''' This I hear. Farewell.

ELVES EXIT. FADE TO BLACK. SHIFT TO EASTERLING ENCAMPMENT, and then INSIDE LORGAN’S TENT.

'''LOR''' This shall not do. For three years this young devil has eluded me, raiding and stealing. He shall drive me to ruin.

'''AIDE''' May I suggest setting a trap for him?

'''LOR''' I have tried it before, but he seems to have some accursed elven-sense that keeps him from harm. Have you anything new to propose? The only way to rid us of him would seem to be asking the King for soldiers to raze all Hithlum in search of him!

'''AIDE''' You need not ask for a whole army, my lord.

'''LOR''' What is that?

'''AIDE''' I have heard that the King of Angband has trackers of an unusual sort. They are bred to find blood.

'''LOR''' Not the werewolves of Gorthaur!

'''AIDE''' Merely tell the King that one of Hador’s line is abroad, and I’m sure he will spare some for our purposes.

'''LOR''' It is well thought-of. Tuor cannot escape the werewolves. So be it!

SHIFT TO NIGHT-TIME. WEREWOLVES APPEAR, and ENTER LORGAN’S TENT. SHIFT TO INSIDE. LORGAN WAKES AND LIGHTS LAMP.

'''LOR''' What is this? [''Gasps'']

'''GTH''' The Master of the World sends his greetings to Lorgan, lord of the fief of Dor-Lómin. [''Morphs into man-figure''] I am Gorthaur, the right hand of the illustrious Melkor.

'''LOR''' [''Rising nervously''] Lord Gorthaur? I am honored by your presence.

'''GTH''' Not at all, man of the East. I have brought three werewolves with me, some of my finest killers. Due to your bungling efforts the son of Huor is alive. His throat will soon be in my jaws.

'''LOR''' Does your master usually send you upon such matters?

'''GTH''' He entrusts me with all such matters of importance. Have a good night, Lorgan. We shall bring you his corpse in the morning.

'''LOR''' Yes, as you say, my lord.

GORTHAUR MORPHS INTO WOLF-FORM. WEREWOLVES FLEE with HOWLS. SHOW SCENES OF THEM SNIFFING AND TRACKING. SHIFT TO TUOR SLEEPING, THEN RISING.

TUOR Something doesn’t feel right.

TUOR SCANS THE TREES. SUDDENLY, WEREWOLF FLIES out AT HIM. TUOR DRAWS SWORD. BATTLE ENSUES. TUOR FORCES WEREWOLF OFF CLIFF INTO RIVER AND FLEES, as other howls rise up. SHIFT TO DAYLIGHT, TUOR WALKING WEST. SHOW SCENES OF FOLLOWING VARIOUS STREAMS, THEN TURNING AWAY as they lead to dead-ends or turn eastwards. SHIFT TO TUOR SITTING on a ROCK mournfully, HEAD LOWERED. SUDDENLY, TURNS to see SPRING FROM HILL, falling into GORGE. WALKS DOWN INTO GORGE. SEES GELMIR and ARMINAS BELOW. THEY TURN, DRAW SWORDS, AND ATTACK. TUOR DOES NOT MOVE, and G&A LOWER WEAPONS.

'''AMN''' Do my eyes belie me, Gelmir?

'''GLM''' Nay. For surely this is a man of the House of Hador. Is not his hair yellow as spun gold?

'''TUOR''' I am Tuor son of Huor, descendant of Hador. You are unlike any other elves I have seen. A light is in your eyes, and your faces seem to shine.

'''AMN''' Well said, Man of Shadows. We are Noldor, who have seen the light that lies in the West across the Sea. We knew Huor in the days of old, and fought beside him in battle. I am Arminas, and this is Gelmir, my brother. We thought that the House of Hador was utterly destroyed. How came you here?

'''TUOR''' I seek escape, and the Gate of the Noldor.

'''GLM''' Your search is ended. We have just come up from the gate. [Points behind to opening] There it stands before you. We can set you on your road, but cannot guide you far. For we are on a mission of great urgency. But fear not. A great doom is written upon your brow, and it shall lead you far from these lands, far indeed from Middle-earth, as I guess.

'''AMN''' Come, Huor’s son, take this lantern. It comes from Valinor, imbued with the light of the stars of Varda, and shall not go out.

ARMINAS HANDS TUOR LANTERN. ALL ENTER CAVERN. SHOW THEM ENTER FROM INSIDE. TUOR LOOKS ABOUT in wonder.

'''GLM''' Beautiful, is it not, Man of Shadows? Yet it is incomparable to what you shall see on the other side.

SCENES OF WALKING DOWN TUNNEL. At last, TWAIN EXIT TUNNEL above FALLS and CIRITH NINNIACH.

'''AMN''' This is the Ravine of Rainbows, which leads down to the Sea. Straight is your course; just follow the ravine. If you wish to find the Havens, your journey must be long, but continue south along the shoreline, and you will find it eventually.

'''GLM''' But now we must return, for our errand is pressing. Matters of great peril are stirring in Beleriand.

'''TUOR''' Has the hour arrived when the King of Gondolin shall come forth?

'''GLM''' What do you know of Turgon, Man of Shadows, and the Hidden City?

'''TUOR''' Only that my father died to save him and his people at the Battle of the Nirnaeth, and that his hidden stronghold is the last hope for Beleriand against Morgoth. Ever the name of Gondolin stirs my heart. Perhaps one day I shall find it.

'''AMN''' Who shall say? I, too, have sought it long and yet never found it. There are no Men who know this. Only the few messengers of Turgon that come forth from the Mountains have this knowledge, and they will tell no-one, for fear that Morgoth will learn.

'''GLM''' Yet I have heard that your House has the favor of the Lord of Waters. And if his counsels lead you to Turgon, then surely you will come to him, wherever you turn. Follow the road placed before you, and fear not, for you shall not long walk in the darkness. The Dweller in the Deep moves many things in this forsaken lands, and I do not think that our meeting was by chance. Farewell, and may we meet again in happier hour. Anar kaluva tielyanna!

GELMIR AND ARMINAS DEPART BACK THROUGH TUNNEL. TUOR TURNS FORWARD, and LOOKS OVER the ravine. BEGINS TO WALK DOWN.

IMAGE: TUOR WALKING along rocky bank of RIVER in CIRITH NINNIACH, suddenly STOPPING and COCKING HEAD as SEA-GULLS MEW far ahead. TUOR MOVES FORWARD, with a light in his eyes, STRAINING to HEAR. MEWING comes again, and TUOR BEHOLDS GULLS FLYING overhead.

'''TUOR''' What beautiful creatures are these white birds! How my heart leaps within me, in anticipation of some great wonder that lies before me.

TUOR WALKS ON. SHIFT TO TUOR WALKING forward TOWARD CAMERA, then coming to STOP UPON ROCK. ANGLE TO VIEW FROM BEHIND TUOR, to reveal the ROARING SEA. TUOR is AMAZED.

'''TUOR''' Surely this is the fulfillment of my wildest dreams. No Man has seen the Sea of which the Elves sing. Surely across its waters lie the Undying Lands of Valinor, and the houses of the Valar.

SHIFT TO BEACH at NIGHT, TUOR SITTING laying beside FIRE. WHISPER COMES, and TUOR RAISES HIS HEAD.

'''GULL (VO)''' Go South, and find what thou canst there.

ANGLE to FROM BEHIND TUOR’S HEAD, to see GULL on ROCK. GULL turns and FLIES AWAY. SHIFT TO DAYTIME, where TUOR is WALKING along the beach. ANGLE FROM BEHIND TUOR. TUOR HALTS, and LOOKS UP AT VINYAMAR. TUOR WALKS ON. SHIFT TO TUOR CLIMBING PATH TO GATES OF VINYAMAR. TUOR HALTS BEFORE GATES, and LOOKS ABOUT HIM. Then TUOR PUSHES OPEN GATES. SHIFT TO INSIDE VINYAMAR. TUOR LOOKS ABOUT HIM at the grandeur of the magnificent hall of stone, its tapestries still hanging. ANGLE TO TABLET, on which light falls. TUOR APPROACHES TABLET and RUNS FINGERS ACROSS MAIL. GULL PERCHES ON HIS SHOULDER.

'''TUOR''' It’s almost as if these were left here for me. This place seems Elvish to me, and there is a wholesome air. This armor is a marvel, the like of which I have never seen. I wonder how long it has waited here; waited, seemingly, for me. I feel somehow as if I were meant to have it. [Touches emblem on shield] By this token shall I take up these arms, and whatever doom they bear.

TUOR TAKES UP MAIL, and PULLS IT ON, CAMERA SHOWING CLOSEUPS OF EACH PIECE OF ARMOR as TUOR places it on himself. Lastly, TUOR PLACES HELM on his head; MUSIC IS QUIET BUT TRIUMPHANT. CAMERA SHIFTS to show TUOR WALKING ALONG BEACH in front of VINYAMAR. Suddenly there is the sound of THUNDER out over the SEA, and TUOR TURNS to GAZE out on the Ocean. SHIFT TO VIEW from BEHIND TUOR. ULMO’S THEME played on French horns and reed instruments, while a heavy wind comes forth from the Sea. Green peaks, seeming to be enshrouded by mist, appear far over the turbulent sea. Then ULMO ENTERS, RISING FROM THE SEA GRADUALLY, UNTIL AS IF KNEELING IN THE WATER.

'''ULM''' Hail, Tuor, of the House of Hador! Fear not my wrath. I am him whom the Noldor name Ulmo, Lord of Waters, Vala of the Sea. Long ago I instructed the elf-lord Turgon to leave the arms thou now bearest in Vinyamar. Long have I called thee to this place, and time grows short. It would have been good hadst thou come in the Spring, but thou must learn haste, for Winter draws near, and thy journey will be hard. A great evil creeps on the Valley of Sirion, and already a host of foes have come between thee and thy goal.

'''TUOR''' What is my goal, Lord?

'''ULM''' That which thy heart hath ever sought. To find Turgon, and look upon Gondolin. For this reason I have arrayed thee as my messenger. Now thou must pass under shadow and peril. Tarry no longer. Wilt thou take up my errand?

'''TUOR''' I will, Lord.

'''ULM''' Take this cloak to hide thyself from evil eyes. [''Throws forth cloak of shadows''] I will set words in thy mouth to say unto Turgon. He is a Noldo, one of those banished from the Undying Lands for his rebellion five centuries ago. Doom is strong, and the shadow of the Enemy lengthens. I alone of the Powers wish to pardon the Elves, and am alone and weak in Beleriand. The curse of Mandos, given after the rebellion, states that all the works of the Noldor will come to ruin. That curse is close to fulfillment. They have one hope left, and that is in thee. A light shall pierce the darkness. From the wrath of Ossë I shall send you a guide, a mariner from the last ship to seek the West before the rising of the Star. Go now!

ULMO BOWS, and raises STAFF. WHIRLWIND COMES, and ULMO EXITS amid it. TUOR STANDS on BEACH as the last strains of ULMO’S THEME fades away. PULLS ON CLOAK. TUOR’S EYES are DOWNCAST, but when he LOOKS UP, he sees VORONWË LYING AT EDGE OF WATER in torn and soaked clothes. TUOR WALKS DOWN, and PULLS VORONWË UP by the arm. TUOR PULLS VORONWË up the beach, and SETS HIM DOWN on his back.

'''TUOR''' Welcome, Voronwë! I have awaited you.

'''VOR''' By all the Valar, get me some water!

TUOR ADMINISTERS WATER to VORONWË. VORONWË SIGHS and LAYS BACK his HEAD on the sands. SHIFT TO NIGHT, WHERE TUOR SITS BEFORE FIRE, VORONWË RESTING NEARBY.

'''VOR''' Who are you, my preserver? Long I have labored against the sea, and I seek tidings. Is the Shadow overthrown? Have the Hidden People come forth?

'''TUOR''' Nay, good mariner. The Shadow lengthens, and the Hidden remain hid. I am a Man. Are you not Voronwë son of Aranwë, last mariner of the last ship to seek the West?

'''VOR''' I am, but my name and errand were secret. How do you know such things?

'''TUOR''' I have spoken with Ulmo, Lord of Waters. You have been saved from the wrath of Ossë that you may become my guide to the Hidden City.

VORONWË REMAINS SILENT. SEVERAL MOMENTS PASS.

'''VOR''' You have spoken with the Lord of Waters. I doubt not your voice. But no man has the right to go thither to Gondolin. Even were I to lead you to the gate, you would be turned away there. The mission would be vain.

'''TUOR''' Nothing ordained by Ulmo is vain. I am Tuor son of Huor, and the name of Huor cannot have been forgotten by Turgon. Nor can he have forgotten the words of Ulmo long ago. No matter how perilous the journey, and no matter how unlikely the outcome, I must go to Gondolin. And you are my ordained companion.

'''VOR''' So be it.

FADE TO BLACK. IMAGE: TUOR and VORONWË WALKING along the ERED WETHRIN. ANGLE TO FACING TUOR. TUOR TURNS to look on last time upon the SEA. VORONWË HALTS and WATCHES TUOR.

'''VOR''' The Sea! No elf can resist its call. We forsook our paradise across the sea, and it is the hope of every Noldo that we may someday return.

TUOR TURNS AWAY and COMES UP BESIDE VORONWË to LOOK OUT OVER MIDDLE-EARTH spread out before them. WOODS OF NÚATH below.

'''VOR''' Beleriand the Wide, west of the Blue Mountains, east of the Great Sea. We have many miles to go. We shall cross the Narog at the Pools of Ivrin, and then pass by the woven wood of Doriath. Gondolin should lie north of that place, amid the Encircling Mountains.

'''TUOR''' The world seems so big.

'''VOR''' It is a lot larger than you can possibly imagine, Tuor. There are lands much greater than Beleriand west of the sea, and large plains and seas to the east that have been unexplored since the beginning of time.

VORONWË MOVES ON. TUOR STANDS STILL for several moments, then FOLLOWS. SHIFT TO SCENE of TUOR AND VORONWË WALKING THROUGH FOREST. SHIFT TO TUOR and VORONWË SITTING DOWN ON LOG, FIRE COOKING VENISON.

'''TUOR''' Tell me your story, Voronwë. I am most interested.

VORONWË CLOSES HIS EYES, then OPENS THEM.

'''VOR''' The story begins in the year 473 in the Years of the Sun, thirty-two years ago. On the coast for many centuries had stood the kingdom of the Falathrim, known as the Falas of the Two Cities [''Image: Eglarest'']. Círdan, most foresighted of all the elves was its lord [''Image: Círdan''], and the enemy could not reach that far. But after the Nirnaeth the Black Foe invaded the Falas [''Image: Sack and burning of Eglarest''], and it fell before him. Almost two thirds of all the elves there were killed or fell into captivity. [''Shift back to Voronwë, who falls silent for a moment''] Turgon heard of this, and knew that he was the last free lord in the North. Morgoth had his eye trained on Gondolin, and Turgon feared it might go ill. He heard that Círdan had survived with some of his followers, and had gone down to found the Havens and the Isle of Balar. Therefore he sent forth messengers [''Image: Messengers coming forth''], bidding Círdan build ships that would bear them westward, to seek Valinor and the pardon of the Valar [''Image: Swan-ships'']. Yet I tarried in the fair land of Nan-tathren [''Image: Voronwë in Nan-tathren''], and came last to Balar. All but one of the seven ships had by then been built, and one by one the mariners had departed never to return [''Image: Ship sailing away'']. I left on the last ship, seeking to find the beauty that I had tasted in the springs I spent in Nan-tathren. [''Shift to Voronwë, who sighs''] The ships of the Falathrim cannot be drowned by any water, but worse things there are in the Great Sea [''Image: Great storm, with Voronwë’s ship and the sounds as if of a monster howling in the darkness, then fade to black'']. For seven years I labored against it, coming to strange and fearful lands, but never to the west. It was shut to us. [''Shift to Voronwë''] At last the ship broke against the rocks off of where you found me, and the sea spit me up onto the sand. I was spared, but had been shown many dreadful deaths in the Sea. [''Voronwë laughs''] And yet very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when the clouds about the West were drawn away. Still at times we would see another cloud to the west; or, as some held, perhaps the mountains of the Pelóri beyond the lost strands of our ancient home. I know not. Far, far away they stand, and none from mortal lands shall come there ever again, I deem. The west is closed.

SHIFT TO TWAIN WALKING THROUGH THE WOOD.

'''VOR''' I look forward to seeing the Pools of Ivrin again. Their beauty is unsurpassed. Few remember when, almost five hundred years ago, Fingolfin the High King called a grand feast there. I remember the mist in the mornings, when we could hear the singing of the nightingales and the cry of the loons! The moonlight would dance upon the shimmering surface of the waters among the reeds at night.

SHIFT TO VORONWË LEAVING FOREST. VORONWË STOPS, SHOCKED.

'''TUOR''' (from behind) What is it, Voronwë?

'''VOR''' All that remains of the Pools of Ivrin, I fear.

SHIFT TO FROM BEHIND VORONWË AND TUOR, SHOW BURNT-OUT BOG.

'''VOR''' Alas! Has the evil come even here? Once far from the threat of Angband was this place; but ever the fingers of Morgoth grope further.

'''TUOR''' It is even as the Lord of Water said.

'''VOR''' Yet a malice has been here with strength greater than that of Orcs. Fear lingers in this place.

'''TUOR''' [''pointing''] Voronwë, look!

SHIFT TO GLAURUNG’S TRACKS.

'''VOR''' Yea, a great evil. Not long ago Glaurung, the Great Worm of Angband, was here, most fell of all the creatures of the Enemy! We are already late. There is need of haste.

ENTER TÚRIN, VORONWË AND TUOR DRAW BACK.

'''TÚR''' Ivrin, Faelivrin! Gwindor and Beleg! Here once I was healed. But now I shall never drink the draught of peace again.

EXIT TÚRIN. VORONWË AND TUOR COME FORWARD.

'''TUOR''' Who was that man, who bore a black sword?

'''VOR''' A strange light was in his eyes. Some fell doom was upon him. I feel as if some dreadful thing has happened. We should not stay.

TUOR AND VORONWË MOVE AWAY. SHIFT TO SKY; SNOW BEGINS TO FALL. SHIFT TO TUOR and VORONWË CROSSING snowy plain. IMAGES OF SNOWY TRAVEL. SHIFT TO WALKING THROUGH COPSE.

'''TUOR''' Voronwë, I don’t know about you, but I cannot survive this much longer. We have not eaten in days, and this cold pierces my very marrow.

'''VOR''' Something fell is in this wind. I do not like it. But look! There is fire.

'''TUOR''' Let us hope they are travelers, and will offer us shelter.

'''VOR''' There are no travelers in this land. Nevertheless we shall get close as we may.

TUOR and VORONWË APPROACH. SHIFT TO THEIR VIEW OF ORC ENCAMPMENT.

'''VOR''' It is a raiding party of orcs.

'''TUOR''' Gurth an Glamhoth! I would risk death for mastery of that fire, or even a piece of their meat.

'''VOR''' We have no choice. We are too few. Let us leave, quickly, before they catch our scent.

PAUSE. ORCS SUDDENLY RISE and TURN in their direction.

'''VOR''' Too late – we must flee.

SCENES OF CHASE. At last, TUOR and VORONWË HUDDLE BENEATH BOULDER.

'''TUOR''' Someday, I vow, I shall be able to put my blade to these servants of Morgoth, rather than flee like a cowed dog.

'''VOR''' May you take joy in the moment, my friend! Here we should be safe. [''Pause''] I heard some of their words? I know a little of their speech. They seek one called Blacksword, and I heard the name of Túrin mentioned.

'''TUOR''' It cannot be the man we saw at Ivrin? Do you not know? Túrin is my cousin, the son of Húrin.

'''VOR''' Some evil fate has found him. Be glad, Tuor, that you are favored by the Valar so. The Blacksword had done evil; he was fay and fell, and his conscience burdened him. Death would be a better lot than his. Ponder these things deeply, Tuor. Understand them, and you may gain much wisdom.

SHIFT TO MORNING. VORONWË RISES.

'''VOR''' By the Valar, look Tuor!

TUOR SITS UP and OPENS HIS EYES. SHIFT TO SCENE BEFORE THEM.

'''VOR''' The Ered Echoriath, the Encircling Mountains! We came further than I thought. Gondolin is not far.

SHIFT TO SCENE OF WALKING OVER RISE, in front the Ford of Brithiach.

'''VOR''' We must wait here. We cannot cross the Ford of Brithiach in daylight, nor while we still are in doubt as to whether or not we are pursued.

'''TUOR''' The cloak of Ulmo will shade us from unfriendly eyes. Time is pressing. We cannot afford the delay.

'''VOR''' [''Looking up, and joy comes into face''] It is well! The Brithiach is still guarded.

'''TUOR''' What do you see, Voronwë?

'''VOR''' Short-sighted are men! Do you not see, up in the sky? The Eagles of the Crissaegrim are here, coming toward us.

EAGLES COME INTO SIGHT. VORONWË BECKONS, but THEY TURN and FLY AWAY.

'''VOR''' Let us hurry. If there are any orcs nearby, they shall be cowering until the Eagles have completely gone.

'''TUOR''' What were they?

'''VOR''' The Great Eagles are the protectors of the Hidden City. No spy of the Enemy has ever gotten past them, and it is because of their vigilance we are safe. Come, now.

TUOR and VORONWË RUN down the slope. SHIFT TO WALKING in FORESTED AREA at FOOT OF MOUNTAINS. VORONWË HALTS BEFORE STREAMBED.

'''VOR''' At last we have found it. This is the mouth of a dry stream. It goes through the gully for a long way, and then we come to the tunnel.

'''TUOR''' It is certainly not what I expected. I had thought to see a great gate barring the entrance, but this is open and would be easily accessible, save that it is a wearying road for the footsore.

'''VOR''' Though Turgon is mighty, he trusts still to secrecy. You shall see these mighty gates, but they are a ways down. Would anyone have seen this as different than any of the other numerous streambeds that come from the Mountains? And yet I will warn you that in entering you are placing yourself in great peril. I may be regarded as a traitor to bring a man thither, and we should both be instantly slain did they have the slightest doubt of suspicion. May the Lord of Waters show his power here, and protect us.

'''TUOR''' Forebode no more, Voronwë. I have been warned. Lead on!

SHIFT TO TWAIN WALKING through STREAMBED. VARIOUS SCENES of this. At last, VORONWË HALTS and POINTS OFF TO THE LEFT, up another DRY TRIBUTARY. THEY WALK UP for a ways, then come to a CAVE MOUTH.

'''VOR''' This is one of thousands of caves in the Ered Echoriath, and yet is the only way to the Orfalch Echor. Our journey is almost over. It will be a tight squeeze, but eventually I believe it widens out.

VORONWË LIGHTS TORCH; BOTH WALK down into the PASSAGEWAY. SHIFT to scenes of WALKING through the darkness. PASSAGE OPENS into LARGE CAVERN. VARIOUS SCENES. ENTER SMALLER PASSAGE AGAIN, WALK for a ways.

'''ELM''' Who goes there?

LANTERN UNVEILED to reveal GUARDS with drawn bows and naked swords.

'''VOR''' [''Stepping forward''] I am Voronwë, a mariner of Turgon King who has returned from a long journey. Far have I walked, yet I still remember your voice, Elemmakil.

'''ELM''' [''Walking forward into the light''] Well do I know thee, Voronwë. But who is this stranger thou hast brought with thee? Thou knowest well that it is against our laws. Step forward, stranger.

TUOR STEPS FORWARD.

'''ELM''' A mortal man, hooded and cloaked. We were long friends, Voronwë. If you had brought one of our own kindred, I would have trusted you. But now you force me to choose between the law and our friendship. He has seen the secret way, and that means I must slay him.

'''VOR''' Not so, my friend. I have acted on greater authority than that of the laws of the White City. The King alone must judge me.

PAUSE.

'''ELM''' I shall take you to the Lord Ecthelion, master of the Great Gate and deemed the wisest of the lords of Gondolin, save for the King himself. Come with me.

SCENES of SEVEN GATES; THEME STRONG in the background. Eventually they come to the GREAT GATE. ECTHELION and GUARDS STAND THERE.

'''ELM''' Hail, Ecthelion, Lord of the Fountains.

'''ECT''' Who are these you have brought with you, Elemmakil?

'''ELM''' It is Voronwë Aranwion, who returns from his long voyages. And a stranger, whom Voronwë demands must see the King.

'''ECT''' You have been brought to the Last Gate. No stranger that passes it may come forth again, save in death.

'''TUOR''' If the messenger of the Lord of Waters go by that door, then all those who dwell here will follow him. Hinder him not.

TUOR THROWS BACK CLOAK, and the SUN SPARKLES on his ARMOR.

'''TUOR''' I am Tuor, son of Huor, sent by Ulmo who moves the Deeps to the Hidden City of Gondolin. I am commanded to go there, and give a message to the son of Fingolfin.

PAUSE.

'''ECT''' No further proofs are needed.

ECTHELION SIGNALS with his hand. The GREAT GATE OPENS, and the PROCESSION WALKS through. ECTHELION LEADS TUOR to the edge of the OVERLOOK. From there TUOR SEES TUMLADEN, with GONDOLIN sparkling in the center like a white gem. GONDOLIN THEME is played fully for the first time.

'''ECT''' Gondolin. May you take pleasure at the sight, son of Huor. Be light of heart, weary travelers, for rest is found here, and beauty. Light and laughter dwell here, and peace.

'''VOR''' There never was a fairer sight.

'''ELM''' But now I must return to my post. Farewell, Tuor, and may we meet again under the stars!

ELEMMAKIL TURNS AWAY.

ECTHELION, TUOR, and VORONWË WALK down the path. Music is loud as alternating shots of them pass by of them walking down the MAIN HIGHWAY across Tumladen. SHIFT to view from WALLS OF GONDOLIN, angled slightly from above. GUARDS STAND solemnly gazing out over Tumladen toward the Mountains. IDRIL ENTERS to look out over the wall. SHIFT back to view from behind TRIO. HORNS SOUND. SHIFT to other places along the WALLS. Many GONDOLIN-FOLK are gathered on the WALLS, LOOKING out at the TRIO. SHIFT to TUOR, CLOSE-UP. TRIO HALTS at the foot of the GONDOLIN STAIRCASE. TUOR takes a deep breath, then MOVES FORWARD. SHOW SCENES of TUOR WALKING up the STAIRCASE. SHIFT to ECTHELION.

'''ECT''' [''Shouting''] Open the gates!

SHIFT to INSIDE of the GATES OF GONDOLIN. GUARDS OPEN GATES, and TRIO WALKS through. HOST of GONDOLIN-FOLK GATHER around the TRIO, looking curiously. ECTHELION takes the lead, and WALKS down the KING’S HIGHWAY. The CROWD PARTS for the TRIO as TUOR and VORONWË follow. SHIFT to scenes showing TRIO WALKING down KING’S HIGHWAY. At last, TRIO ASCENDS to KING’S SQUARE. ENTER PALACE and GREAT HALL. TURGON SITS there on his throne, accompanied by GLORFINDEL, IDRIL, MAEGLIN, and TRAIN OF NOBLES. TURGON STANDS.

'''TUR''' Long has been the journey of the Man of Shadows, and yet he comes at last to his heart’s desire. Welcome, Messenger of the Lord of Waters. Tell me thy name, and from whence thou comest.

'''TUOR''' Hail, Turgon King son of Fingolfin, wisest and greatest of the Noldor east of the Sea! I am Tuor son of Huor, who has come out of Nevrast. Time presses.

CLOSEUP of TUOR’S FACE. HIS EYES SHINE, and his FACE IS IMMOBILE.

'''TUOR''' Hear the voice of Ulmo: That the time has now come indeed when all the works of the Noldor shall come to naught. Doom is at hand, and now the Mover of the Deeps bids thee rise up and leave Gondolin forever. Seek the West, and the pardon of the Valar. For in that alone may you be preserved.

LIGHT in TUOR’S EYES DIES. SHIFT TO TURGON.

'''TUR''' Do you think I have been idle during these long years? Do you think that I do not yearn for Valinor? I sent messengers to Círdan of the Havens, bidding him build ships and seek the West. How many have returned? Only Voronwë Aranwion, who stands beside you. The West is closed.

'''TUOR''' If you place your lives in the hands of the Valar, such an act of faith may stir them to action against the Dark Enemy.

'''TUR''' This I cannot do. I would be placing the lives of all the Gondolindrim at risk. I am one of the last of my house, and the people of Gondolin are nearly the last remnant of the Noldor in Middle-earth. Why should I trust the Valar to save us now, when they have been deaf to the Elves these longs years? My father and all my brothers are dead. Where were they when Hithlum was sacked, or the Falas were destroyed? Where were they at the Nirnaeth, in our hour of need? Though it be the counsel of Ulmo himself, who guided me long ago to Gondolin, I will not do this thing.

'''TUOR''' Then I will only bid you remember the words of Ulmo that he spoke to you long ago: “Love not too well the work of thy hands and the devices of thy heart; and remember that the true hope of the Noldor lieth in the West, and cometh from the Sea.”

'''MAG''' My lord, Gondolin lies still hidden from the eyes of the Black Shadow. Even were the Enemy to escape the eyes of the Eagles, he could scarcely assail us here. Are we to abandon all that we have toiled and bled for these hundreds of years? Are we to place the fate of thousands into the pitiless hands of the Powers, who dwell in bliss in the West and care nothing for the troubles across the Sea?

'''TUR''' You speak well, Maeglin. I knew your father, Tuor, and loved him as a brother; the more so because he saved my life and that of my people, sacrificing his own to keep us safe at the Nirnaeth. I also know that Ulmo is the friend of Man and Elf. But it is not his people that he would place upon so fragile a hope. It is not he who has been ignored by the Valar when in need. The Doom of Mandos lies on us still. We deserved our exile, I do not deny it. But if they will not give us pardon, we must trust to our own strength, the strength of the Noldor, and this city.

TUOR TURNS and WALKS AWAY, OUT of the PALACE and to the edge of the KING’S SQUARE, STANDING to overlook the city. TURGON COMES up behind him, and LAYS A HAND ON TUOR’S SHOULDER.

'''TUR''' Stay in Gondolin, Tuor. It would not only be for your father’s sake that I would welcome you as a son.

'''TUOR''' Thank you, Lord King, I will.

'''TUR''' [''Turning to Voronwë''] Voronwë, I welcome you back to Gondolin. Go with Tuor as his guide.

'''VOR''' With a good will, Lord King.

SHIFT BACK TO TUOR, who LOOKS AT IDRIL. IDRIL LOWERS her HEAD. SHIFT TO TUOR and VORONWË WALKING through the GARDENS.

'''VOR''' I am sorry, Tuor. Turgon is very old, and has seen many things under the sun and moon, and still more before they were wrought. He heard the Doom of Mandos pronounced. He is deemed the wisest of the Noldor in Beleriand.

'''TUOR''' And yet he who has seen the Valar will not trust to their mercy.

'''VOR''' You do not know how much of his heart he has poured into this city. He loves his people, but has seen death and horror, and many battles. He thinks he does what is best. The city is strong.

'''TUOR''' But doom is stronger. [''Pause''] Who was that one who stood beside the King, and counseled against me?

'''VOR''' That was Maeglin, Turgon’s nephew. His mother was Aredhel, the King’s sister, who was lost while traveling abroad. When she returned, she brought with her a young son. It seems that she was trapped and forced into marriage with a Dark Elf, one of the Moriquendi named Eöl. The Dark Elf followed the two to Gondolin, and was taken before the King. Eöl would not accept the mercy of the King, and chose death rather than to remain in the city forever. He would have killed his own son, but Aredhel took the blow for him, and died. Eöl was executed shortly after. Nevertheless Maeglin, their son, has grown up strong and bold, and holds the favor of Turgon and many of the lords of Gondolin, for he is wise and cunning.

'''TUOR''' And who was the woman sitting at the King’s right hand?

'''VOR''' Idril, the King’s daughter, one of the fairest maidens of Gondolin.

'''TUOR''' Is Gondolin so untroubled that it can cultivate such beautiful flowers?

'''VOR''' It is peaceful here, but none may forget the Exile and the Nirnaeth.

SHIFT TO ROG’S FORGE. VORONWË and TUOR ENTER.

'''VOR''' I am taking you to Rog, the chieftest of our smiths. He has wanted to see you ever since you arrived.

ROG TURNS from his anvil.

'''ROG''' I have waited long for your coming, messenger of Ulmo. I was compelled years ago to forge a weapon unlike any I have yet made. Was it not I who forged Glamdring, sword of Turgon, and the greatest blades of Gondolin? And yet this work is greater still.

ROG WALKS to a RACK and LIFTS UP DRAMBORLEG. HE WALKS TOWARD TUOR.

'''ROG''' This is Dramborleg, which in the tongue of Men is called Sharp Stroke. The blade shall neither break nor bend, nor will it rust or blacken though it lie in the ground for a thousand years.

TUOR TAKES DRAMBORLEG and RAISES IT UP. ROG BOWS REVERENTLY. SHIFT TO TUOR and VORONWË WALKING OUT OF the FORGE.

'''TUOR''' What happened to him? Why is he so bent and scarred, when all the Gondolindrim I have seen are tall and fair?

'''VOR''' Long ago he was captured and tortured by balrogs. He took the name of Rog, come from the elven word meaning “bent”, and roughened it until it sounds uncouth on our tongues. He professes an undying hatred to the Dark Lord and his servants, especially the balrogs.

SHIFT TO GARDENS, where IDRIL WALKS THOUGHTFULLY. MAEGLIN APPROACHES.

'''MAG''' Fairer than the petals of the elanor are the maidens of Gondolin, taller and sweeter than the golden mallorn-trees, and yet Idril Turgon’s Daughter is fairer than they, even as they are to mortals.

'''IDR''' Maeglin, your approaches profit you nothing.

'''MAG''' Am I to be despised because I love you so fully and so well?

'''IDR''' You know that it is forbidden for you to marry your cousin, by the laws of the city and of the Eldar. And I have let you know full well that my heart leans not to your advances.

'''MAG''' So I am tortured night and day. And yet to be with you is joy, though fleeting. I would that we were wed, more than anything in the world.

'''IDR''' I pity you, Maeglin. And yet this desire is unwholesome. Leave me, and try and forget this passion.

ENTER GLORFINDEL.

'''GFD''' Is Maeglin troubling you, my lady?

'''MAG''' You would naturally be here, meddler and window-peerer, Glorfindel of the Golden Flower.

'''GFD''' I meant no discourtesy. But if the Lady Idril is in any way threatened by your behavior.

GLORFINDEL PUTS his HAND on MAEGLIN’S ARM.

'''IDR''' Glorfindel, let him go.

'''GFD''' On your way then, dark elf [''Releases Maeglin'']. And do not address the Lady again without her consent.

MAEGLIN EXITS.

'''GFD''' He is bad, through and through.

'''IDR''' Not wholly, I think. But two sides strive for mastery of his soul, and his desire, though borne out of one side, can turn him to the other.

'''GFD''' Yet you are safe in Gondolin, my lady.

'''IDR''' My heart turns ever westward. I was only a child when I left Valinor with my father, and yet you grew up there, and now must ever feel the memory of that place.

'''GFD''' The messenger has disturbed you, then?

'''IDR''' I love my father, Glorfindel. But he has lost his faith, and almost his hope. We cannot stay hidden forever, though Thorondor and Ulmo and all the powers of Beleriand try and protect us.

'''GFD''' I long only for battle, and the feel of orc-blood on my blade once more.

'''IDR''' You were the greatest warrior among us. And yet by no power of the Noldor may the Dark King Morgoth be thrown down.

'''GFD''' You speak well and wisely, my lady. My heart as well aches for the West, more than ever since the coming of Huor’s son. Whether by the sword or by the ship, I hope that one day I shall return there. I long to see white shores again, and the fair green country. Thus I fear not death.

'''IDR''' Ecthelion says that you have taken to dreaming of late. And yet your dreaming must be sweeter than the living.

'''GFD''' The West still lives. One day, the Valar shall pardon us, and we will return.

PAUSE.

'''IDR''' Leave me, Glorfindel, for I have much to think about.

GLORFINDEL BOWS and EXITS. SHIFT to TUOR SITTING UNDER A TREE in the GARDENS. ENTER IDRIL. TUOR STARTS UP.

'''TUOR''' My lady.

TUOR BOWS, IDRIL SMILES.

'''IDR''' Does Gondolin fulfill your expectations, son of Huor?

'''TUOR''' It exceeds them, my lady. I feel as if I have just come from darkness into light. There is so much life here, in the fountains and the trees.

'''IDR''' And what of where you came from? Had you no-one to mourn your departure?

TUOR SITS DOWN.

'''TUOR''' My mother departed Hithlum never to return after the death of my father, when I was but a babe. I was an outlaw, who dwelt alone in the Land of Shadows, always under a cloud of fear.

IDRIL KNEELS BESIDE HIM.

'''IDR''' I regret now greatly that Huor must have died to protect the Hidden City.

'''TUOR''' And yet, having seen it, I do not. If Gondolin were to lie cold and dark under a clouded sky, then all light would pass from the north. He sacrificed his life to preserve this beauty. So would I.

'''IDR''' And yet there comes a time when all things must fail. I had a dream three nights before you came.

'''TUOR''' And what did you see, my lady?

'''IDR''' I saw the White City in flames. The trees were burning, the fountains were dry. Her maidens and young children were lying out on the streets, all dead. Night had fallen.

'''TUOR''' Let us pray that your dream was of things that might come, rather than of those which will.

TUOR and IDRIL LOOK long at one another.

'''TUOR''' What is that brooch you wear?

'''IDR''' It is the elessar, a symbol of hope and healing, one of the greatest treasures ever produced by our smiths. It is said to make the weary fresh and strong, to make the downcast fair and light of heart, and the wounded whole. I found healing in its touch. I lost my mother, Elenwë, during the exile. It was a terrible journey, though I was just a child then.

'''TUOR''' And has Turgon been healed by it as well?

'''IDR''' [''Sadly''] He refuses to touch it. For five centuries he has dwelt with his grief. He has cloaked it, for his mind is strong, but inwardly he is pained with a great pain, and though he hates it he will not release it.

SHIFT TO TUOR and VORONWË in HALL OF THE CHRONICLE.

'''VOR''' This is the Hall of the Chronicle. On the walls of this hall are painted the history of the world from its making unto the Nirnaeth. Look well, Tuor.

SCENES OF TUOR LOOKING OVER VARIOUS PAINTINGS. Light is high, music is full, motion is slowed down. HE STOPS BEFORE PAINTING.

'''TUOR''' Who are these?

'''VOR''' They are Beren, a mortal of the House of Bëor, and Lúthien Tinúviel, fairest of the Elves and daughter of Thingol King of Doriath. They met on a time in the forest. Beren had escaped the dreadful doom of the north, and beheld her dancing. The two fell in love, though one was mortal and the other was lasting. Their love took them through many adventures, during which they cast down the fortress of Gorthaur and escaped the stronghold of Morgoth with a Silmaril from the dark lord’s crown as Lúthien’s bride-price. Beren was slain, but Lúthien followed him even after death, and death released them to live for a time upon the earth as mortals together. And then Lúthien was counted among the race of Men, even beyond the ending of the world. There has never been a union like it, neither before nor after.

TUOR TURNS AROUND to SEE ANOTHER PAINTING on the opposite wall. CLOSEUP. TUOR TOUCHES FACE OF HUOR.

'''VOR''' Thus was the Nirnaeth, and Huor son of Galdor in that dark hour. A dark fate pursues the men of that line.

'''TUOR''' Yet perhaps I have broken it.

'''VOR''' Much sorrow do I see in store for you, but also joy. Your fate shall be unprecedented and, maybe, unrepeated.

'''TUOR''' And it seems I must accept it.

SHIFT TO SCENE OF TUMLADEN, from OVERLOOK. Sky is overcast and dark, and raining lightly. HORSEMEN RIDE and HALT briefly, before RIDING DOWN ROAD. SHIFT TO SCENE OF GATEHOUSE.

'''DLN''' Who goes there?

PAN TO BELOW.

'''GAL''' Galdor of the House of the Tree. I bring news.

'''DLN''' Open the gates! Galdor has returned!

SHIFT TO GREAT HALL. TURGON SITS on the throne, about him ENTOURAGE.

'''GAL''' [''Bowing''] My lord, I bring terrible news. Nargothrond has fallen.

MURMURING FILLS HALL. TURGON STANDS.

'''TUR''' And my cousin, Orodreth?

'''GAL''' He is dead.

TURGON SITS in shock.

'''TUR''' Nargothrond has fallen. I am the last of my line in Middle-earth.

GALDOR BOWS HEAD.

'''TUR''' [''Looks up''] And who are these with you, Galdor?

'''GAL''' These are Noldor, escaped slaves of Morgoth. They saved my life in Nan Dungortheb.

'''SPY1''' [''Steps forward''] Hail, Turgon King. Long have we labored under the chains of the Enemy. Our bodies may be ill-used, but to the last breath they will serve you.

SPY1 TURNS to LOOK AT TUOR. Their EYES MEET.

'''TUR''' [''Extending staff''] I accept your allegiance.

SPY1 TOUCHES tip of STAFF. SHIFT TO ROAD, DAYLIGHT. CROWDS WALKING ABOUT, SPIES IN GROUP. TUOR STANDS WITH VORONWË AMONG CROWD.

'''TUOR''' They’re always together, Voronwë. They do not speak to us, they do not laugh or enjoy the sun.

'''VOR''' They have spent many years in captivity. Not many escape from the Enemy. The Lord Rog has not been the same since his capture. It does not surprise me that they are unsociable for the time being. But it may wear off in time. It did with Lord Rog.

'''TUOR''' I don’t like the look in their eyes. I feel like I’m looking into those of an animal, those of a savage animal.

'''VOR''' Those that fall under the shadow and yet return are never unchanged.

'''TUOR''' For this do I fear them.

SHIFT TO SCENE in KING’S SQUARE. Nighttime, stars burning brightly above. TUOR STANDS GAZING out over Tumladen. VORONWË APPROACHES from behind.

'''VOR''' You’re up rather late, man of shadows.

'''TUOR''' I cannot sleep, my friend. I have been thinking. I have been thinking of Gondolin. How did Turgon build such a magnificent city in secret?

'''VOR''' Ulmo showed the King this place long ago, and at that time Morgoth’s darkness did not cover the face of the earth. The alliance kept him trapped in Angband, his fortress in the north. Turgon kept this place secret from even his father the High King, and planned with the greatest architects of the Noldor a city in memory of our home in the West, the beautiful Tirion. The construction went on in absolute secrecy for two and fifty years. Then the Noldor raised up their voices and cried, “Tirion is born again, the Lily of the Plain.” All the Gondolindrim love her, Turgon most of all. He was able to pour his dreams and his genius into this city, to put his mind on other things than his dead wife. Every year this city gets bigger, and more beautiful.

SHIFT TO SPIES 1 2 3 4 CREEPING THROUGH PALACE DOORS.

'''TUOR''' Look! What are they doing entering the palace?

'''VOR''' Shall we call the guards?

'''TUOR''' No, it may be nothing. Follow behind me, and be ready to shout.

TUOR and VORONWË FOLLOW SPIES DOWN HALLS. TUOR suddenly KNOCKS STOOL OVER. SPIES SPOT HIM and RUN DOWN HALLS.

'''TUOR''' Call the guards, Voronwë! I’ll pursue.

VORONWË SPLITS OFF, SHOUTING. TUOR BEGINS TO RUN AFTER SPIES, but HESITATES.

'''TUOR''' They’re heading for the Royal Quarters. I know a quicker way.

TUOR TURNS OFF and RUNS DOWN NARROW PASSAGES. LEAPS OVER EDGE of PARAPET in front of SPIES and DRAWS DRAMBORLEG. SPIES DRAW KNIVES.

'''TUOR''' Dramborleg!

FIGHT. TUOR KILLS TWO. SHIFT TO IDRIL’S CHAMBER. SPY WALKS THROUGH DOOR, IDRIL STARTS UP. SPY RAISES KNIFE. TUOR CUTS SPY DOWN from behind. TUOR and IDRIL STARE at one another. ENTER TURGON, VORONWË with swords, and GUARDS.

'''TUR''' Well struck, son of Huor. Idril, my daughter, are you all right?

'''IDR''' I am fine, father.

HORN SOUNDS in DISTANCE.

'''VOR''' The others are trying to escape through the gate!

'''TUR''' [''To guards''] Get our horses. Celegvyr, signal the Eagles.

SHIFT TO OUTSIDE PALACE DOORS. TUOR and VORONWË LEAP FORWARD, JUMPING ONTO TWO HORSES. TURGON and GUARDS MOUNT shortly after. SCENES OF RIDING to the GATE. SHIFT TO GATE, where GUARDS 1 2 BATTLE SPIES 5 6 7 8. ENTER MAEGLIN.

'''MAG''' Desist, brigands!

SPY 8 TURNS TOWARD HIM. MAEGLIN HALTS.

'''SPY8''' Maeglin, nephew of Turgon.

GUARD 1 DIES.

'''SPY8''' You are a cunning lord, a son of your father the Dark Elf. You need not fear us. You would be welcomed by the Power of the North. His rewards are great. He could give you anything you asked for. Gondolin shall fall. We shall escape, and it shall not be long before Morgoth knows where the Hidden City is, and shall destroy it.

'''MAG''' No, no.

'''SPY8''' Gold, gems, honor… a high position in my Master’s army. One day my Master shall even overthrow death, and you can stand beside him and revenge yourself on those you hate most. You would receive your choice of spoils of Gondolin… wealth, or people.

'''MAG''' No, Gondolin shall stand!

SPY8 LAUGHS. MAEGLIN LEAPS FORWARD with SWORD. SPY8 DUCKS SWORD and SLAMS MAEGLIN in the midriff. MAEGLIN FALLS TO THE FLOOR, GASPING.

'''SPY8''' Remember my words… Dark Elf.

GATES OPEN just as PURSUERS COME into sight (dead guards can be seen on the ground). SPIES ON HORSES RIDE OUT. OTHERS PURSUE. SHIFT TO CELEGVYR LAUNCHING SIGNAL. SHIFT TO SCENES of CHASE ON TUMLADEN. TUOR COMES ALONGSIDE SPY 5 and KILLS HIM with DRAMBORLEG. OTHER SPIES SUDDENLY HALT and TURN to THROW DAGGERS at TURGON. TUOR MOVES to the side and DEFLECTS TWO DAGGERS with DRAMBORLEG, OTHER DAGGER HITS TUOR’S HORSE. TUOR FALLS OFF.

'''TUR''' Glorfindel, shoot me the leader!

GLORFINDEL BENDS BOW and HITS SPY 6 in LEFT SHOULDER. SPY 6 FALLS from HORSE. SPIES 7 8 ride off. OTHERS PURSUE. SPY 6 RISES FROM GROUND with SWORD, WALKING TOWARD TUOR. TUOR GROPES FOR DRAMBORLEG, BUT SPY 6 CHARGES. VORONWË DOUBLES BACK and DECAPITATES SPY 6. TUOR NODS THANKS.

'''VOR''' We’ll never catch those other two.

'''TUOR''' They’ll reach the mountains and escape!

'''VOR''' No, they won’t.

EAGLES CRY ABOVE THEM TERRIBLY. SWOOP DOWN on SPIES. SPY 7 IS RAISED UP BY EAGLE 1 and TORN WITH BEAK BEFORE BEING DROPPED. SPY 8 RAISES BOW and SHOOTS THORONDOR in the WING, but THORONDOR HURLS HIM FROM HORSE and FLIES AWAY with SPY 8 in talons. LANDS BEFORE TURGON, who has RIDDEN BACK to TUOR and VORONWË.

'''THOR''' Turgon King, I bring thee thine enemy.

'''TUR''' My thanks, Lord Thorondor. Ye have done well. Speak, spy, false to your race, in the name of all the Valar!

'''SPY8''' There is no god but Morgoth; there is no word but his. He is coming to get you. You cannot stay hidden in your precious city forever. [''Dies'']

'''TUR''' You saved my life, Tuor, and that of my daughter. All Gondolin shall learn of this. I welcomed you once as a son, for your father’s sake, but now I welcome you as a son for your own sake.

SHIFT TO VIEW FROM ABOVE OF TUOR AMONG THE CHEERING CROWDS OF GONDOLINDRIM. SHIFT TO TURGON, GLORFINDEL, AND ECTHELION IN TOWER OF THE KING.

'''TUR''' Tuor has become a hero in the minds of the Gondolindrim. None cease to give him praise, man though he is. Tell me, my lords, do you think I do wrongly?

'''GFD''' My lord?

'''TUR''' Am I wrong to not heed the words of Ulmo? Am I wrong to stay in Gondolin, against the counsel of the Valar?

'''GFD''' Your reasoning is understandable, Turgon. We all felt betrayed by them long ago.

'''TUR''' But you nevertheless feel I should listen to them?

'''ECT''' Lord King, it was Ulmo the Vala who brought you here, and it is thus Ulmo the Vala who has hitherto kept us safe.

'''TUR''' I know it well, friend Ecthelion. But you must realize what it would mean to listen to him. Ulmo is not in hiding in the midst of a desolate land prowled by the spies of Morgoth. Ulmo did not spend years and much toil and sweat and – aye – blood for the foundation of this city. If we listened to him and abandoned Gondolin, we would first have to pass through wide, rugged lands prowled by legions of orcs [''Image: Nan Dungortheb'']. Then, we would have to cross the great plains, out in the open and exposed [''Image: Talath Dirnen'']. Then we would have to find some way down the cliffs and steep hills of the Andram [''Image: Andram'']. After that, we would follow the Great River Sirion for many leagues to the Bay of Balar [''Image: Sirion down to Balar'']. Then, spend years in constant danger while the Shipwrights of Círdan build us enough ships to carry us all [''Image: construction of ships'']. When the ships are built, we dare the dangers of the Western Seas [''Image: ships on sea'']. If the Valar are merciful, we may find at last Valinor [''Shift to Turgon's face'']. But if their hearts are closed still, our entire race will drown. Here, we are hidden. The eagles of Thorondor protect us faithfully, and the mountains shelter us. Even if we were found, no enemy, however big the army, could assault the city. We cannot be starved out, for food can be produced within the city indefinitely, and pure springs will not let us succumb to thirst [''Image: Gondolin garden'']. Our walls are high and strong [''Image: walls from below'']. Even could the beasts of Morgoth climb the insurmountable rock of Amon Gwareth [''Image: moving up Amon Gwareth''], they could neither breach our walls nor climb them. The gate is large and unbreakable [''Image: gate'']. We can withstand siege without end, and not even Morgoth has an army that can overthrow Gondolin [''Shift to Turgon’s face; pause'']. I am sorry, my friends and counselors. I would never tell another this, but I am old, old and afraid; afraid of what is to come. Afraid to move, afraid to stay here. They call me Turgon the Wise. Wise I may be; perhaps too much so. I have lost my faith, for I see too much. They say the Elves do not age. Yet for some, what the body shows not the mind reveals only too much. I must be strong before my people, but within me my heart is failing.

'''ECT''' You are right, my lord. Gondolin shall stand. Hope is not lost.

'''TUR''' Not for the Noldor perhaps. But I wish only to live and die with Gondolin. I have seen all my family die in Middle-earth; It may be that I have lived too long.

SHIFT TO SCENE OF TURGON and ECTHELION IN KING’S SQUARE. AMID TREES, IDRIL and TUOR LAUGH and PLAY.

'''TUR''' It seems that my daughter has taken a great liking to the Man of Shadows.

'''ECT''' If I may be so bold, my lord, a liking that may turn to love.

'''TUR''' So I am not the only one who has noticed it. You are a shrewd man, Ecthelion, whose mind perceives many more things than your mouth lets on about.

'''ECT''' Do you intend to forbid their love?

'''TUR''' Ecthelion, do your remember the last words of Huor at the Nirnaeth to our ears?

'''ECT''' I cannot forget, my lord.

'''TUR''' (''With Huor VO'') Out of your house shall come the hope of Elves and Men. Though we part here forever, from you and from me a new star shall arise. (''No VO'') Long have I pondered these words. The fate of the Noldor is bound to this messenger. I love him as I would a son. If he pursues his suit, I shall not – indeed, I cannot stand in their way.

'''ECT''' But he is a man, and she is of the immortal kind.

'''TUR''' Such a union has happened once before, and though death was their lot in the end, there was also bliss. Idril will never love another, and I know that she would be happy with this man. Death will be her fate in the end, if I am not mistaken. But it shall be a sweet death. This prophecy may be of the union of Tuor and Idril. Even if it is not, I shall die contented, though maybe I shall envy their bliss.

WEDDING SCENE IN GAR AINION. VARIOUS SCENES IN SLOW MOTION, MUSIC CLEAR AND SOFT. VARIOUS SHOTS AS TURGON SINGS SLOWLY, INCLUDING THE BIRTH OF EÄRENDIL.

'''TUR (VO)''' [''Quenya (with subtitles?)'' In the West, beyond the sea, there grew two trees. One shone with gold, the other with silver, and cast their light across the lands. O Valinor! Never may we forget thy mountains tall. O Valinor! We always long to see green shores once more.]

FADE TO BLACK. CAPTION: Ten years later… ENTER IDRIL, TUOR, and EÄRENDIL. EÄRENDIL RUNS FORWARD ACROSS LAWN.

'''IDR''' Are you happy here, Tuor? Tell me truthfully.

'''TUOR''' Very much so.

'''IDR''' Are you sure, my husband?

'''TUOR''' How could I not be happy? I have a wife and a beautiful boy-child, a fair house, and a whole company at my command. But…

'''IDR''' The sea.

'''TUOR''' How did you know?

'''IDR''' You are constantly gazing westward, sometimes singing. You murmur in your sleep, sometimes about your father and your home in the Shadows, but usually about the gulls and the lapping of the waves.

'''TUOR''' I have heard the music of Ulmo, beloved, and never will it leave me. One day, I shall build a house by the sea, and we shall live always listening to the Mover of Waters.

'''IDR''' And when could that happen?

'''TUOR''' I shall, if only at the renewing of the world.

ENTER MAEGLIN, MOUNTED. EÄRENDIL APPROACHES.

'''EDL''' Master Maeglin!

'''MAG''' Eärendil! [''dismounting and catching up Eärendil in his arms''] How are you, my dear boy?

PAN TO OVER MAEGLIN’S SHOULDER, TOWARD TUOR AND IDRIL. MAEGLIN PUTS EÄRENDIL DOWN.

'''IDR''' Maeglin.

'''MAG''' Idril, Lord Tuor. I am leaving Gondolin for several days, searching for ore in the mountains.

'''TUOR''' [''nodding, coldly''] Very well, Maeglin.

MAEGLIN, AFTER STARING AT IDRIL AND EÄRENDIL, MOUNTS AND RIDES AWAY.

'''MAG''' MAEGLIN WALKS TOWARDS FOUNTAIN, SITS ON EDGE WITH HEAD IN HANDS. VIEW FEET WALKING TOWARDS HIM, THEN STOP] Salgant, why must it be this way?

'''SAL''' That depends on what you mean.

'''MAG''' I don’t know rightly. It hasn’t been a very good day.

'''SAL''' If you wish to tell-

'''MAG''' That will be fine. I would like to be alone.

SALGANT TURNS TO LEAVE THEN STOPS WHEN MAEGLIN STARTS TALKING

'''MAG''' I remember when I first came to Gondolin. I had hated my father, and anywhere where he was not seemed to be great already. Something would always tell me that I would follow his path, no matter how hard I try. But Gondolin was new [SHOW MAEGLIN RIDING INTO GONDOLIN WITH ALL OF IT'S SPLENDOR] Glorious...far greater than all my mother’s tales. [SHOW TURGON GREETIN AREDHEL AND MAEGLIN, WHO IS PROBABLY A TEENAGER]

'''MAG''' Long have I waited to see this day come. And you bring a son, my sister. [TO YOUNG MAEGLIN] I suppose it seems strange, to meet your family for the first time. But, with your consent, I would be as a father to you, and love you in stead of your father, as he should have. [SHOW IDRIL IN THE BACKGROUND AS TURGON KEEPS TALKING] Glad is my heart to see you, Aredhel. The city brightens at your return. Maeglin [FOCUS BACK ON TURGON AND MAEGLIN] I believe you will become great among Gondolin, and it will be my pleasure to see to it. [SHIFT BACK TO IDRIL, WHO IS NOW LOOKING DOWN, AS MUSIC COMES STRONGER THE VOICES FADE UNTIL WE ARE JUST FOCUSING ON IDRIL]

'''GUARD''' (fading out) Eol, your sister’s husband is here. Should we escort him in?

[FADES TO MAEGLIN, STILL A TEENAGER, WALKING IN THE GARDEN TOWARDS IDRIL]

'''IDR''' Is there anything you need, Maeglin?

'''MAG''' I wouldn’t mind talking to someone from the city, myself being new...

'''IDR''' [smiles] And your cousin should be a guide as well as a mentor, companion, and consultant? You have been speaking with me your whole time here. Would you that I spend the rest of my life with you? [BOTH PAUSE AWKWARDLY. IDRIL'S SMILE VANISHES BUT MAEGLIN GRINS]

'''MAG''' I won’t deny that I envy the man that would do so. But forgive me; I forget that you are my cousin, not knowing you until today. But I find your friendship alone to be a kind and fulfilling one.

'''IDR''' [slightly cold] Thank you, Maeglin. I should be going. [MAEGLIN LOOKS AT THE STARLIT SKYLINE OF GONDOLIN. THE EVENING TURNS TO DAY AS WE LOOK DOWN ON THE KINGS SQUARE, YEARS LATER, AS MAEGLIN AND IDRIL ARE NOW GROWN. SETTING IS A CELEBRATION IN KING'S SQUARE/ INSIDE GREAT HALL, AND TURGON APPROACHES MAEGLIN

'''TUR''' Great you are, Maeglin, and great you have become. From building our great Gate of Steel to saving our people at Dagor Nirneath, you have proven faithful. With your parents gone, I would hope even to adopt you as my son...

'''MAG''' It indeed has been a pleasure to serve you, my King.

'''MAG''' (present): I do not know why I think of it now. I see how they are happy and I am stripped even of all I had, even before he came....That day.

[WE ARE BACK AT THE CELEBRATION IN THE KING'S SQUARE. FOCUS SHIFTS FROM MAEGLIN TO A NEWCOMER IN THE BACKGROUND. WE SEE THIS IS TUOR, JUST HAVING ARRIVED IN GONDOLIN. THE SAME SCENE UNFOLDS FROM MAEGLIN'S POINT OF VIEW. VOICES BECOME AUDIBLE AS MAEGLIN STEPS UP BEHIND TUOR.]

'''TUOR''' Then I will only bid you remember the words of Ulmo that he spoke to you long ago: “Love not too well the work of thy hands and the devices of thy heart; and remember that the true hope of the Noldor lieth in the West, and cometh from the Sea.”

'''MAG''' My lord, Gondolin lies still hidden from the eyes of the Black Shadow. Even were the Enemy to escape the eyes of the Eagles, he could scarcely assail us here. Are we to abandon all that we have toiled and bled for these hundreds of years? Are we to place the fate of thousands into the pitiless hands of the Powers, who dwell in bliss in the West and care nothing for the troubles across the Sea? [ZOOM TO TUOR'S FACE, THEN MAEGLIN'S, SHOWING A SLIGHT UNEASINES BETWEEN THE TWO. THE CONVERSATION CONTINUES IN A FADED MANNER, BUT ALL MAEGLIN SEES IS THE WAY TUOR IS LOOKING AT IDRIL.]

[COURTYARD AGAIN, TUOR HAS BEEN TALKING TOIDRIL AND NOW LEAVES. MAEGLIN STEPS FROM THE SHADOWS AND SPEAKS, STARTLING IDRIL. MAEGLIN IS COLDER TOWARDS HER NOW.]

'''MAG''' I see residue of the past.

'''IDR''' Maeglin- you should have made your presence known.

'''MAG''' Do not worry, I only just arrived. One wouldn’t have needed to hear much to understand. I will say the past returns. Do you fawn over every newcomer to the city, or just the ones royal enough for your taste?

'''IDR''' I never loved you, Maeglin. You live on a delusion.

'''MAG''' Of course. I forgot that part. What is so terrible of me that I must be despised? We are not so different, Tuor and I. Both new, connections with your father. I suppose you have not tired of him yet as you have of me. Or is it because he is mortal? Is that-

'''IDR''' Were you not even my cousin I would still not love you. Your foolish presumptions cause my dislike of you to grow into a hate.

'''MAG''' Very well, my lady. I shall no longer bother you. I hope your precious Tuor gladdens you as much as I have, at least I will know I am no different than the others. [He strides out of the courtyard and we see Idril, who is looking down, raise her gaze after Maeglin. Fade to Idril, now standing in wedding gown in a flash to the same wedding scene shown earlier. This time the focus shifts and we see Maeglin in the background. He turns and leaves and we follow him to a courtyard and fountain, where he sits on the fountain edge, head in hands, proceeding to weep. Looking into the fountain the water splashes and now we see Maeglin in the present, shoulders heaving.]

'''MAG''' And all these years later I find I still love her, but only in hate. And hate for him...

'''SAL''' I know not who you speak, but I –

'''MAG''' I believe you know. But I must confuse you. Forgive me; I needed to sort things out. I should be going. Look after my people, the strong folk of the Mole. You I trust for this. [He mounts his horse again and rides out of the city. Cut to Maeglin riding into mining camp.]

'''MINER''' Master Maeglin, we have awaited your arrival. We have made progress, but the supply has run low [MAEGLIN DISMOUNTS AND WALKS BESIDE HIM] Three of the mines are all but run out of ore.

'''MAG''' Very well. We should move further up.

'''MINER''' Towards Gondolin doesn’t show much, and we are at the king’s perimeter.

PAUSE

'''MAG''' I think you know what I mean. A few paces beyond the king’s leaguer make little difference. Move up a league.

'''MINER''' Yes, my lord.

BACK IN GONDOLIN

[IDRIL AND TUOR AT HOME, SUNSET. TUOR WALKS TO IDRIL, STOOPING TO KISS HER BUT STOPS]

'''IDR''' Tuor?

'''TUOR''' Yes, fair one?

'''IDR''' Please, it is something serious. I had a strange dream.

'''TUOR''' What importance can a dream be? But of course if it is anything of your concern it indeed is vital. [KISSES HER FOREHEAD]

'''IDR''' I dreamt that someone attacked us.

'''TUOR''' (ALARMED) You should fear not of such things, for I would slay he who would even lay a hand on you.

'''IDR''' It was for no harm to me. I know not who. He was dark and cold. [SHOW MAEGLIN RIDING THROUGH MINING CAMP] He built a great furnace of evil. [SHOW SPARKS FLY FROM ONE OF THE ORE MINING FURNACES. MAEGLIN LOOKS AWAY AS AN ORC FLIES AT HIM, TAKING HIM FROM HIS HORSE, AND A LARGE ORC RAIDING PARTY IS AMONGST THE CAMP. CUT BACK TO IDRIL.]Building it up he took our son and cast him into it, and he watched our agony... then he slew you[SHOW MAEGLIN IN ANGBAD] he was full of hate and evil, yet he was from among us. [TUOR AND IDRIL STAND SILENT, STARING AT EACH OTHER, THEN CUT BACK TO THE IMAGE OF MAEGLIN'S TORTURE. NOW HIS SCREAMS PENETRATE THE SILENCE. MORGOTH STEPS INTO THE ROOM ]

'''MORGOTH''' There is a faded light of the Noldor in your eyes. How came thou here when the Noldoli are but deceased, save the cowards of Gondolin? [MAEGLIN RESPONDS IN MORE SCREAMING, THEN THE TORTURE MOMENTARILY STOPS.] There is strength in you, Maeglin, but you are not strong. You have power but you do not use it. Your life is riddled with one missed opportunity after another. You know of what I speak, for I know even your thoughts. Come to a worthless end, you have led a worthless life. Son of a careless father and a rebellious mother, you follow their footsteps even unto death. You show yourself for who you are. You did not deserve Gondolin, and Gondolin indeed cast you, always a second, aside. Tell me now: what honor is gained by dying in these dismal dungeons? You would not save your people, but become a worthless traitor, as the man Hurin [Show Hurin wandering, staring at the encircling mountains and yelling for Gondolin]. You will serve my kingdom or submit to serving my kingdom. But it is not all lost for you. I, after all, am just like all the other gods, and just like you- misunderstood, misunderstood because I had a will just like all of the other gods. They were too selfish to let me carry out my will while they did as they pleased. Gondolin is too selfish to let you do as you would, restraining you with petty laws- they too do as they please. You could not marry Idril because of birth- chance! Whom does she turn to? -A common man. I desire to carry out my will as you desire to carry out yours. And only with knowledge of Gondolin’s location can we carry out both. [ZOOM TO MAEGLIN'S FACE]

[IN THE PALACE, MEETING OF THE HOUSES OF GONDOLIN.]

'''TUR''' That concluding business, dismissed.

'''TUOR''' [Walks up to Turgon] Might I have a word with you in private, my lord?

'''TUR''' No, to you I am ‘Father’. What would you have of me?

'''TUOR''' Idril has been of worry lately, and it would do her good comfort if there were a guard, a few loyal Gondothlim, who would be to her, our, personal aid.

'''TUR''' Nothing evil has crept into Gondolin, I hope? We are unassailable.

'''TUOR''' That was my thought as well, but she worries, and should an incident occur as that what happened with the spies so many years ago....

'''TUR''' You need not explain. I will commission a twelfth house of Gondolin, after your lordship. You may name them what you will.

'''TUOR''' That is very kind of you, my- Father. They will be the Folk of the Wing, if that is permissible to you, for that was the symbol of my people.

'''TUR''' So it shall be, my son. [THEY EMBRACE] Great was the day you came to Gondolin. There is little I would not do for you and my daughter. [THEY BEGIN TO WALK OUT] Have you any word on Maeglin? Salgant was here to take his place. It would be a dark day should anything happen to him, for I value his advice near to yours.

'''TUOR''' [FACE HARDENS] I know not, save that he was to go to the encircling mountains for a while mining for ore. I am sure his is capable of keeping all well.

[TUOR'S ESTATE, TUOR AND IDRIL ARE WALKING IN THE GARDEN, AND EARENDIL ARE RUNNING AROUND THEM]

'''IDR'''[LAUGHING] A house of Gondolin? Tuor, I ask for a flower and you give me a dozen!

'''TUOR''' Well there aren't very many, and it is mainly for our protection. But [GRABS A HANDFUL OF FLOWERS FROM A BUSH] Flowers are the least you deserve. [IDRIL SMILES, TAKES THEM AND THEY KISS.] I find my love for you waxes every day, as though we were married yesterday.

'''IDR''' [LAUGHS] As do I...

'''TUOR''' Come! I will show you wht else I have in store for your protection. [HE SWEEPS UP EARENDIL ON HIS SHOULDER AND LEADS IDRIL DOWN THE STREET. THEY COME OF TO '''THE SECRET WAY''', A TUNNEL LEADING OUT OF THE CITY. VORONWE IS THER) Voronwe! How goes the work?

'''VOR''' We are near finished, my friend.

'''TUOR''' Thank you, once again.

'''VOR''' Gladly, for the man who saved me.

'''TUOR''' That was Ulmo’s doing, you should remember.

'''IDR''' You built another tunnel?

'''TUOR''' Too many know of the Escape way, so I thought a secret way wold be appropriate for any need. It is much safer. Not that we would need such a thing, but precaution in light of Ulmo’s warning is wise.

'''EAR''' A tunnel? Where does it go to? Can I go in?

'''TUOR''' No, my son, it is certainly not for careless use [TO IDRIL] It is only for most dire need.

[NIGHT COMES UPON GONDOLIN AND WE SEE SCENES FROM AROUND THE CITY AS THE SUN SETS OVER THE HILLS, IDRIL IS OUT ON THE BALCONY TELLING EARENDIL TALES OF THE SUN AND THE MOON.]

'''IDR''' And Arien then leads the sun all the way around the earth, and under the earth until it is time for a new day....[EARENDIL IS ASLEEP IN HER ARMS, AND SHE LIFTS HIM AND PUTS HIM TO BED. SHE GAZES AT HER SON THEN FEELS TUOR'S HAND ON HER SHOULDER; THEY LOOK AT EACHOTHER THEN AT EARENDIL. CUT TO THE SUN SETTING OVER THE MOUNTAINS.]

</poem>

[[Category:Screenplays]]

User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/Fall of Gondolin

2008-05-15T04:19:19Z

Maeglin: /* General Discussion */

Greetings! This is the screenplay for Tolkien's epic story, ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]''. The title "''Fall of Gondolin''" may or may not be kept. We may start the script either with [[Tuor]], or with [[Turgon]]'s building of [[Gondolin]], or with a certain "fictional" character who sees Turgon. Unlike the [[Lay of Leithian]] or the [[Narn i Chîn Húrin]], it is possible to insert a "fictional" character, that is one the writers made up, to put the story into more "story-like" form. The other option would be to center on Tuor himself.

As far as my own ideas for the general style of the production go, I believe this production would do well with a sort of poetic style. That is, a heavy emphasis on music and landscape, for instance. Also, the world will be revealed through Tuor's eyes; we see Gondolin for the first time at the same time he does, for instance. Discuss this screenplay below, and feel free to challenge anything if you see fit. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]]

==General Discussion==
General discussion below this line.

== Maeglin vs. Tuor ==

For me the fall of gondolin rotates around the Turgon's obstiance, Tuor's family and Maeglin and Tuor's rivalry. It may be just me, but I wonder if for dramatic purposes it would be good to make Tuor vs. Maeglin a climactic fight(and probably a little later in the battle) rather than Tuor flinging Maeglin off a cliff first thing. Could this be good? (I have figured how this would work, considering a few technicalities.)

==New script additions==

I have written a rather large chunk of the script going up to the beggining of the battle, and I am posting it in chunks, especially since I am converting it to the proper format. I know this is a lot of script, much of it will probably be unneccescary so I wanted to add a couple notes.

First of all, please edit it (of course). I pretty much took the policy o more rather than less so there will probably be some uneccescary stuff (namely the large part I have already posted on Maeglin). I really don't mind whatever you switch. There may be a couple parts of sentmental attatchent tha I thinkre important, but really fee free to shang it around (that's what this is for!)

additionally, I'm not sure how specific I should be with direction, etc. so if I am unclear let me know and I will clarify it.

I think that's all I can think of for this segment, I will be posting other segments quickly as possible.

==Lords of Gondolin==

Should there be a scene (Such as a meeting) that would introduce the lords of gondolin systematically (as well as a couple integral names) to clarify things? Or would that complicate it- people that don't get it don't need to.

I think this also ties in with a couple general questions- is it better on the whole to add more and thus make it longer? Is it better to go into more detail?

== Maeglin subplot ==

Would it be worth it to add a minor subplot concerning Maeglin's upbringing? It would probably only be a few minutes and could intertwine with Tuor's youth, perhaps. Does that sound reasonable or am I just being irrational because I like Maeglin(thus my username)? At any rate I think it would be worth mentioning his past in order to set up his role.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 22:44, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

:Personally, I would prefer that the audience see Gondolin revealed through Tuor's eyes. I think a few brief flashbacks would be good as Maeglin's character is developed, but in my opinion there's no need to show bits of Maeglin's story alongside Tuor's. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:56, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

===Galdor's name===

Should we change Galdor's name? Because of how early in the legendarium he appears I should think it to be forgivable. The point is that I don't want people confusing Tuor's grandfather with this elf-lord (nor do I think Tolkien would, if he had ever rewritten the tale). In one scene I wrote Tuor as saying, "I am Tuor, son of Huor, son of Galdor, son of Hador." Galdor the elf-lord is a minor character, but he does appear at least once by name. A simple solution would be to just have Tuor say, "I am Tuor son of Huor, descendant of Hador." Or, we could change Galdor's name to something else (or even replace Galdor's role altogether with an "invented" character). What are your opinions? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:27, 21 December 2007 (EST)

:I kind of like the idea of just not mentioning his name, it doesn't confuse people and yet it doesn't go against what Tolkien wrote. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 12:04, 21 December 2007 (EST)

===Title Ideas===

* The White Citadel
* Gondolin
* The Hidden Rock/ Secrect City
* Plain old 'The Fall of Gondolin'?

==Questions/suggestions/comments==

===Scenes===

Synopsises below. You may add on ideas as you wish, directly after the synopsises under their own heading.

====One====
The prologue scene; in this scene, [[Ulmo]] will do a voiceover as [[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]] places the armor in [[Vinyamar]]. Ulmo should introduce Turgon's calling to Gondolin, and the promise of a messenger to herald the end. Turgon's face should be hidden during the entirety of this scene, either hooded or merely not shown directly.

====Two====
In this scene [[Tuor]] should escape from the [[Easterlings]], introducing his lineage and the position of [[Men]].

====Three====
Here Tuor heads west, coming to [[Belegaer]]. He will eventually be whispered-to by a gull, a sort of messenger from Ulmo, and head south to Vinyamar. There he enters and discovers the armor, putting it on.

====Four====
In this scene Tuor exits Vinyamar to stand on the sands in front. As he does so, he spies storm-clouds westward over the sea, and hears thunder. Ulmo appears in all his majesty, with his horns calling, and charges him with a mission.

====Five====

==Conceptual Design==
Below shall be discussion for Conceptual Design, and below the discussion conceptual drawings.

Leitmotif code: Each normal letter signifies a quarter note, with ","s to seperate them into beats. "+" or "-" are added to show whether the following note is the one above or below it; a double of either of these shows that it is that note plus and octave. If there is a "/" between two regular notes, that shows both notes to be eighth-notes; double "/" shows them to be sixteenth, and so on. Half-notes are denoted when italicized, and whole notes when boldened. A connecting slur is denoted by "_", while a dot is ".". See below the example:

"Mary had a little lamb": E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, ''E'', -D, D, ''D'', +E, +G, ''G'', -E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, E, E, -D, D, +E, -D, '''-C'''.

===Persons===
====[[Tuor]]====
Tuor should be a rough-looking sort of man to begin with, but at the same time tall and lordly. Rather like the description of [[Aragorn II|Aragorn]], yet not quite so rugged and "in-tune" with the wild. He should always show a certain cleanliness, even when in the wilderness. After he enters Gondolin, he should be always dressed simply, generally in white and blue.

His leitmotif is somewhat wild and free, a little rustic, but tuneful. It also has a solid, low subtone that suggests nobility or royalty. Ideal instruments would be violin, harp, and/or whistle.

====[[Idril]]====
Idril generally wears, like her father, white and red, though occasionally blue and silver can be found in her outfits. Her hair is long and golden, reaching below her waist, often crowned with golden leaves or with a braid.

Idril's leitmotif is high but soft, probably in flutes, whistles, and/or a solo singer. It is probably the most romantic theme, yet not overly so. It remains soft and simple, without being rich and reinforced by a host of other instruments. Best compared to the [http://www.amazon.com/Braveheart-Original-Motion-Picture-Soundtrack/dp/B000004286/sr=8-1/qid=1165590369/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-5960899-5574333?ie=UTF8&s=music theme to Mel Gibson's ''Braveheart'' (see samples for tracks 2-4)].

====[[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]]====
Turgon is very tall and proud, grave of face; reflective and wise. Like his people, his garments are simple, though fine. He is often found in silver-gray or white, and his silver crown contains large red garnets. In great ceremonies he wears red and white, embroidered with gold, carrying a staff carved of white wood, with a gull carved on the end.

His leitmotif is very sturdy and regal. It relies much upon brass, perhaps French Horns or trumpets, playing slowly and solemnly. It also has a distinct tinge of sadness or wistfulness.

Idea leitmotif (3/4): E, ''+A'', +B, ''+C'', -A/+B, +C, +D. /-C, -B, -G, -D, ''+E'', +F#, ''+G'', +A/-G, -F#. /-E, -D, ''+E''

====[[Voronwë of Gondolin|Voronwë]]====

In the beginning Voronwë is dressed in simple gray; a loose tunic and brown belt. Later he wears blue and silver, but always somewhat simply, without jewelry and always loosely.

Voronwë's leitmotif is played ideally on pipes or harps, like the Sea theme but lower. It is wild and quiet, somewhat simple as well, with a tinge of wistfulness.

====[[Ulmo]]====

Ulmo appears as he is described, very strong, in shining mail. Despite his even bearing, he has a bit of wildness about him.

His theme, too, is similar to both the Valinor and Sea themes. It is a combination of whistles in a high, churning melody, and low, sweet strings and horns in a slow, regal and beautiful theme.

====Lords of Gondolin====

[[Glorfindel]] is light-hearted, but very powerful and fiery. [[Ecthelion of the Fountain|Ecthelion]] is more stoic, with quiet emotion and a cold but steady sword-arm. [[Rog]] is misshapen, and it is suggested that he was once tortured by Morgoth; he has a fierce hate of evil, and a love of his art of smithing. All others feature only as minor: [[Egalmoth]] and [[Galdor of the Tree|Galdor]] appear several times with speaking roles, [[Penlod]], [[Duilin of Gondolin|Duilin]], and possibly [[Salgant]] are relegated to a non-speaking (except possibly for several short phrases) background role.

Glorfindel's leitmotif would be played on the woodwinds; high and noble, but seeming never to be still, always active. Ecthelion's is more horns and flutes, a regal, tuneful theme with a tinge of sadness and solemnity. Rog's is deep, with drums and a suggestion of darkness and great anger.

:Rog leitmotif idea (bass clef): A, +C, -Bb, +E, -D, +E, -C, +D#, -A, +B
:Glorfindel leitmotif idea (upper clef, high register; steady A below): E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/-E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/+E/-C/-A/-E/E/+A, C

====[[Maeglin]]====

Maeglin is generally dressed in black embroidered with silver, never excessively ornamented. He should be handsome and dark-haired, but with a somewhat rough voice.

His leitmotif can be played either quick or slow depending on the situation. It is, in its way, beautiful; played either minor or major, with occasional twists and surprise movements, but steady. Possible instruments would be strings or woodwinds.

====Inhabitants of [[Gondolin]]====
In Gondolin it is accepted that weapons are not generally openly displayed, except for guards on duty or during special ceremonies. Men wear Roman-like tunics, but often longer and more robe-like. Women typically have long dresses similar to those in fashion in Medieval Europe in the 14th century, but looser and lighter of material. In ceremonies of importance both their robes are still simple (no elaborate layers decked with gems or anything like that), but embroidered with gold, silver, and other colors. Soldiers wear surcoats bearing the emblem of their house, beneath which is fish-scale mail.

===Places===
====[[Dor-Lómin]]====

Scandinavia.

====[[Gondolin]]====
Idea leitmotif (4/4): A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/-D, +F, -E, A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/+G, -F#, -D

=====[[Square of the King]]=====

A four-sided area on a raised portion near the center of the City of Gondolin. On the far side is the great white palace of King Turgon, with the high tower spiraling up from its center. On either side of the bronze doors of the palace is a tree, one of gold and one of silver ([[Glingal]] and [[Belthil]]). The space of their branches is great enough that a score of elves could sit in each of their boughs, and they are filled with many singing white birds. In the middle of the courtyard, however, is the main attraction: a great fountain, formed by a natural geyser coming from the earth. It shoots up twenty-seven fathoms in the air, seeming to be made of crystal rain. The courtyard is bordered by a low wall of white stone, from which one could look out on the whole city, and just inside the walls by many beautiful green trees, though far smaller in stature than Glingal and Belthil.

=====[[Square of the Folkwell]] (Gardens)=====

A place of light and beauty. The ground is laid by smooth white stone like marble, and great trees grow about them. The roots of the trees are planted each in a raised area of green, grassy earth, which are close enough together that the sunlight comes down in shafts through the branches. Each of the circles is about fourteen cubits in diameter. Some of the mallorns have buildings in their high bows. The trees form a sort of ring around the Folkwell, which is fully two fathoms across and nine fathoms deep clear. It is fed by a spring down at the bottom, and the excess water is piped off to feed the trees of the Square.

=====Hall of the Chronicle=====

Not found in Tolkien's works. The hall is long and white, with a high ceiling. Windows are found just below the ceiling, on a clerestory. The paintings of the history are unbroken, one painting shifting into the other, in bright colors of blue, red, gold, silver, etc., very much in the romantic style.

=====[[Gar Ainion]]=====

A place, again, of light and beauty, with an ephasis on gold, white, and green. It is regular in shape, with arches leaving it open to the winds. Trees grow around it, especially mallorns. Its stone is white and laced with vines, inlaid with intricate gold engravings of leaves and scenes of hunts and bliss in Valinor.

====[[Firth of Drengist]]====
Ideal filming locations would be Cathedral Caves in New Zealand or Cape Cove in Oregon. Both are very different, so it's one or the other. The description in ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]'' is of trees, white sands, and great cliffs beset with caverns and spoutholes.

====[[Vinyamar]]====

==References==
*[[The Fall of Gondolin]], [[Book of Lost Tales 2]]
*[[The Silmarillion]]
*[[Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin]]
__NOTOC__

User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/Fall of Gondolin

2008-05-15T04:14:29Z

Maeglin: /* Title Ideas */

Greetings! This is the screenplay for Tolkien's epic story, ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]''. The title "''Fall of Gondolin''" may or may not be kept. We may start the script either with [[Tuor]], or with [[Turgon]]'s building of [[Gondolin]], or with a certain "fictional" character who sees Turgon. Unlike the [[Lay of Leithian]] or the [[Narn i Chîn Húrin]], it is possible to insert a "fictional" character, that is one the writers made up, to put the story into more "story-like" form. The other option would be to center on Tuor himself.

As far as my own ideas for the general style of the production go, I believe this production would do well with a sort of poetic style. That is, a heavy emphasis on music and landscape, for instance. Also, the world will be revealed through Tuor's eyes; we see Gondolin for the first time at the same time he does, for instance. Discuss this screenplay below, and feel free to challenge anything if you see fit. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]]

==General Discussion==
General discussion below this line.

==New script additions==

I have written a rather large chunk of the script going up to the beggining of the battle, and I am posting it in chunks, especially since I am converting it to the proper format. I know this is a lot of script, much of it will probably be unneccescary so I wanted to add a couple notes.

First of all, please edit it (of course). I pretty much took the policy o more rather than less so there will probably be some uneccescary stuff (namely the large part I have already posted on Maeglin). I really don't mind whatever you switch. There may be a couple parts of sentmental attatchent tha I thinkre important, but really fee free to shang it around (that's what this is for!)

additionally, I'm not sure how specific I should be with direction, etc. so if I am unclear let me know and I will clarify it.

I think that's all I can think of for this segment, I will be posting other segments quickly as possible.

==Lords of Gondolin==

Should there be a scene (Such as a meeting) that would introduce the lords of gondolin systematically (as well as a couple integral names) to clarify things? Or would that complicate it- people that don't get it don't need to.

I think this also ties in with a couple general questions- is it better on the whole to add more and thus make it longer? Is it better to go into more detail?

== Maeglin subplot ==

Would it be worth it to add a minor subplot concerning Maeglin's upbringing? It would probably only be a few minutes and could intertwine with Tuor's youth, perhaps. Does that sound reasonable or am I just being irrational because I like Maeglin(thus my username)? At any rate I think it would be worth mentioning his past in order to set up his role.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 22:44, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

:Personally, I would prefer that the audience see Gondolin revealed through Tuor's eyes. I think a few brief flashbacks would be good as Maeglin's character is developed, but in my opinion there's no need to show bits of Maeglin's story alongside Tuor's. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:56, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

===Galdor's name===

Should we change Galdor's name? Because of how early in the legendarium he appears I should think it to be forgivable. The point is that I don't want people confusing Tuor's grandfather with this elf-lord (nor do I think Tolkien would, if he had ever rewritten the tale). In one scene I wrote Tuor as saying, "I am Tuor, son of Huor, son of Galdor, son of Hador." Galdor the elf-lord is a minor character, but he does appear at least once by name. A simple solution would be to just have Tuor say, "I am Tuor son of Huor, descendant of Hador." Or, we could change Galdor's name to something else (or even replace Galdor's role altogether with an "invented" character). What are your opinions? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:27, 21 December 2007 (EST)

:I kind of like the idea of just not mentioning his name, it doesn't confuse people and yet it doesn't go against what Tolkien wrote. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 12:04, 21 December 2007 (EST)

===Title Ideas===

* The White Citadel
* Gondolin
* The Hidden Rock/ Secrect City
* Plain old 'The Fall of Gondolin'?

==Questions/suggestions/comments==

===Scenes===

Synopsises below. You may add on ideas as you wish, directly after the synopsises under their own heading.

====One====
The prologue scene; in this scene, [[Ulmo]] will do a voiceover as [[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]] places the armor in [[Vinyamar]]. Ulmo should introduce Turgon's calling to Gondolin, and the promise of a messenger to herald the end. Turgon's face should be hidden during the entirety of this scene, either hooded or merely not shown directly.

====Two====
In this scene [[Tuor]] should escape from the [[Easterlings]], introducing his lineage and the position of [[Men]].

====Three====
Here Tuor heads west, coming to [[Belegaer]]. He will eventually be whispered-to by a gull, a sort of messenger from Ulmo, and head south to Vinyamar. There he enters and discovers the armor, putting it on.

====Four====
In this scene Tuor exits Vinyamar to stand on the sands in front. As he does so, he spies storm-clouds westward over the sea, and hears thunder. Ulmo appears in all his majesty, with his horns calling, and charges him with a mission.

====Five====

==Conceptual Design==
Below shall be discussion for Conceptual Design, and below the discussion conceptual drawings.

Leitmotif code: Each normal letter signifies a quarter note, with ","s to seperate them into beats. "+" or "-" are added to show whether the following note is the one above or below it; a double of either of these shows that it is that note plus and octave. If there is a "/" between two regular notes, that shows both notes to be eighth-notes; double "/" shows them to be sixteenth, and so on. Half-notes are denoted when italicized, and whole notes when boldened. A connecting slur is denoted by "_", while a dot is ".". See below the example:

"Mary had a little lamb": E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, ''E'', -D, D, ''D'', +E, +G, ''G'', -E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, E, E, -D, D, +E, -D, '''-C'''.

===Persons===
====[[Tuor]]====
Tuor should be a rough-looking sort of man to begin with, but at the same time tall and lordly. Rather like the description of [[Aragorn II|Aragorn]], yet not quite so rugged and "in-tune" with the wild. He should always show a certain cleanliness, even when in the wilderness. After he enters Gondolin, he should be always dressed simply, generally in white and blue.

His leitmotif is somewhat wild and free, a little rustic, but tuneful. It also has a solid, low subtone that suggests nobility or royalty. Ideal instruments would be violin, harp, and/or whistle.

====[[Idril]]====
Idril generally wears, like her father, white and red, though occasionally blue and silver can be found in her outfits. Her hair is long and golden, reaching below her waist, often crowned with golden leaves or with a braid.

Idril's leitmotif is high but soft, probably in flutes, whistles, and/or a solo singer. It is probably the most romantic theme, yet not overly so. It remains soft and simple, without being rich and reinforced by a host of other instruments. Best compared to the [http://www.amazon.com/Braveheart-Original-Motion-Picture-Soundtrack/dp/B000004286/sr=8-1/qid=1165590369/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-5960899-5574333?ie=UTF8&s=music theme to Mel Gibson's ''Braveheart'' (see samples for tracks 2-4)].

====[[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]]====
Turgon is very tall and proud, grave of face; reflective and wise. Like his people, his garments are simple, though fine. He is often found in silver-gray or white, and his silver crown contains large red garnets. In great ceremonies he wears red and white, embroidered with gold, carrying a staff carved of white wood, with a gull carved on the end.

His leitmotif is very sturdy and regal. It relies much upon brass, perhaps French Horns or trumpets, playing slowly and solemnly. It also has a distinct tinge of sadness or wistfulness.

Idea leitmotif (3/4): E, ''+A'', +B, ''+C'', -A/+B, +C, +D. /-C, -B, -G, -D, ''+E'', +F#, ''+G'', +A/-G, -F#. /-E, -D, ''+E''

====[[Voronwë of Gondolin|Voronwë]]====

In the beginning Voronwë is dressed in simple gray; a loose tunic and brown belt. Later he wears blue and silver, but always somewhat simply, without jewelry and always loosely.

Voronwë's leitmotif is played ideally on pipes or harps, like the Sea theme but lower. It is wild and quiet, somewhat simple as well, with a tinge of wistfulness.

====[[Ulmo]]====

Ulmo appears as he is described, very strong, in shining mail. Despite his even bearing, he has a bit of wildness about him.

His theme, too, is similar to both the Valinor and Sea themes. It is a combination of whistles in a high, churning melody, and low, sweet strings and horns in a slow, regal and beautiful theme.

====Lords of Gondolin====

[[Glorfindel]] is light-hearted, but very powerful and fiery. [[Ecthelion of the Fountain|Ecthelion]] is more stoic, with quiet emotion and a cold but steady sword-arm. [[Rog]] is misshapen, and it is suggested that he was once tortured by Morgoth; he has a fierce hate of evil, and a love of his art of smithing. All others feature only as minor: [[Egalmoth]] and [[Galdor of the Tree|Galdor]] appear several times with speaking roles, [[Penlod]], [[Duilin of Gondolin|Duilin]], and possibly [[Salgant]] are relegated to a non-speaking (except possibly for several short phrases) background role.

Glorfindel's leitmotif would be played on the woodwinds; high and noble, but seeming never to be still, always active. Ecthelion's is more horns and flutes, a regal, tuneful theme with a tinge of sadness and solemnity. Rog's is deep, with drums and a suggestion of darkness and great anger.

:Rog leitmotif idea (bass clef): A, +C, -Bb, +E, -D, +E, -C, +D#, -A, +B
:Glorfindel leitmotif idea (upper clef, high register; steady A below): E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/-E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/+E/-C/-A/-E/E/+A, C

====[[Maeglin]]====

Maeglin is generally dressed in black embroidered with silver, never excessively ornamented. He should be handsome and dark-haired, but with a somewhat rough voice.

His leitmotif can be played either quick or slow depending on the situation. It is, in its way, beautiful; played either minor or major, with occasional twists and surprise movements, but steady. Possible instruments would be strings or woodwinds.

====Inhabitants of [[Gondolin]]====
In Gondolin it is accepted that weapons are not generally openly displayed, except for guards on duty or during special ceremonies. Men wear Roman-like tunics, but often longer and more robe-like. Women typically have long dresses similar to those in fashion in Medieval Europe in the 14th century, but looser and lighter of material. In ceremonies of importance both their robes are still simple (no elaborate layers decked with gems or anything like that), but embroidered with gold, silver, and other colors. Soldiers wear surcoats bearing the emblem of their house, beneath which is fish-scale mail.

===Places===
====[[Dor-Lómin]]====

Scandinavia.

====[[Gondolin]]====
Idea leitmotif (4/4): A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/-D, +F, -E, A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/+G, -F#, -D

=====[[Square of the King]]=====

A four-sided area on a raised portion near the center of the City of Gondolin. On the far side is the great white palace of King Turgon, with the high tower spiraling up from its center. On either side of the bronze doors of the palace is a tree, one of gold and one of silver ([[Glingal]] and [[Belthil]]). The space of their branches is great enough that a score of elves could sit in each of their boughs, and they are filled with many singing white birds. In the middle of the courtyard, however, is the main attraction: a great fountain, formed by a natural geyser coming from the earth. It shoots up twenty-seven fathoms in the air, seeming to be made of crystal rain. The courtyard is bordered by a low wall of white stone, from which one could look out on the whole city, and just inside the walls by many beautiful green trees, though far smaller in stature than Glingal and Belthil.

=====[[Square of the Folkwell]] (Gardens)=====

A place of light and beauty. The ground is laid by smooth white stone like marble, and great trees grow about them. The roots of the trees are planted each in a raised area of green, grassy earth, which are close enough together that the sunlight comes down in shafts through the branches. Each of the circles is about fourteen cubits in diameter. Some of the mallorns have buildings in their high bows. The trees form a sort of ring around the Folkwell, which is fully two fathoms across and nine fathoms deep clear. It is fed by a spring down at the bottom, and the excess water is piped off to feed the trees of the Square.

=====Hall of the Chronicle=====

Not found in Tolkien's works. The hall is long and white, with a high ceiling. Windows are found just below the ceiling, on a clerestory. The paintings of the history are unbroken, one painting shifting into the other, in bright colors of blue, red, gold, silver, etc., very much in the romantic style.

=====[[Gar Ainion]]=====

A place, again, of light and beauty, with an ephasis on gold, white, and green. It is regular in shape, with arches leaving it open to the winds. Trees grow around it, especially mallorns. Its stone is white and laced with vines, inlaid with intricate gold engravings of leaves and scenes of hunts and bliss in Valinor.

====[[Firth of Drengist]]====
Ideal filming locations would be Cathedral Caves in New Zealand or Cape Cove in Oregon. Both are very different, so it's one or the other. The description in ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]'' is of trees, white sands, and great cliffs beset with caverns and spoutholes.

====[[Vinyamar]]====

==References==
*[[The Fall of Gondolin]], [[Book of Lost Tales 2]]
*[[The Silmarillion]]
*[[Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin]]
__NOTOC__

User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/Fall of Gondolin

2008-05-15T04:13:29Z

Maeglin: /* General Discussion */

Greetings! This is the screenplay for Tolkien's epic story, ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]''. The title "''Fall of Gondolin''" may or may not be kept. We may start the script either with [[Tuor]], or with [[Turgon]]'s building of [[Gondolin]], or with a certain "fictional" character who sees Turgon. Unlike the [[Lay of Leithian]] or the [[Narn i Chîn Húrin]], it is possible to insert a "fictional" character, that is one the writers made up, to put the story into more "story-like" form. The other option would be to center on Tuor himself.

As far as my own ideas for the general style of the production go, I believe this production would do well with a sort of poetic style. That is, a heavy emphasis on music and landscape, for instance. Also, the world will be revealed through Tuor's eyes; we see Gondolin for the first time at the same time he does, for instance. Discuss this screenplay below, and feel free to challenge anything if you see fit. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]]

==General Discussion==
General discussion below this line.

==New script additions==

I have written a rather large chunk of the script going up to the beggining of the battle, and I am posting it in chunks, especially since I am converting it to the proper format. I know this is a lot of script, much of it will probably be unneccescary so I wanted to add a couple notes.

First of all, please edit it (of course). I pretty much took the policy o more rather than less so there will probably be some uneccescary stuff (namely the large part I have already posted on Maeglin). I really don't mind whatever you switch. There may be a couple parts of sentmental attatchent tha I thinkre important, but really fee free to shang it around (that's what this is for!)

additionally, I'm not sure how specific I should be with direction, etc. so if I am unclear let me know and I will clarify it.

I think that's all I can think of for this segment, I will be posting other segments quickly as possible.

==Lords of Gondolin==

Should there be a scene (Such as a meeting) that would introduce the lords of gondolin systematically (as well as a couple integral names) to clarify things? Or would that complicate it- people that don't get it don't need to.

I think this also ties in with a couple general questions- is it better on the whole to add more and thus make it longer? Is it better to go into more detail?

== Maeglin subplot ==

Would it be worth it to add a minor subplot concerning Maeglin's upbringing? It would probably only be a few minutes and could intertwine with Tuor's youth, perhaps. Does that sound reasonable or am I just being irrational because I like Maeglin(thus my username)? At any rate I think it would be worth mentioning his past in order to set up his role.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 22:44, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

:Personally, I would prefer that the audience see Gondolin revealed through Tuor's eyes. I think a few brief flashbacks would be good as Maeglin's character is developed, but in my opinion there's no need to show bits of Maeglin's story alongside Tuor's. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:56, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

===Galdor's name===

Should we change Galdor's name? Because of how early in the legendarium he appears I should think it to be forgivable. The point is that I don't want people confusing Tuor's grandfather with this elf-lord (nor do I think Tolkien would, if he had ever rewritten the tale). In one scene I wrote Tuor as saying, "I am Tuor, son of Huor, son of Galdor, son of Hador." Galdor the elf-lord is a minor character, but he does appear at least once by name. A simple solution would be to just have Tuor say, "I am Tuor son of Huor, descendant of Hador." Or, we could change Galdor's name to something else (or even replace Galdor's role altogether with an "invented" character). What are your opinions? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:27, 21 December 2007 (EST)

:I kind of like the idea of just not mentioning his name, it doesn't confuse people and yet it doesn't go against what Tolkien wrote. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 12:04, 21 December 2007 (EST)

===Title Ideas===

* The White Citadel
* Gondolin
* The Hidden Rock/ Secrect City

==Questions/suggestions/comments==

===Scenes===

Synopsises below. You may add on ideas as you wish, directly after the synopsises under their own heading.

====One====
The prologue scene; in this scene, [[Ulmo]] will do a voiceover as [[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]] places the armor in [[Vinyamar]]. Ulmo should introduce Turgon's calling to Gondolin, and the promise of a messenger to herald the end. Turgon's face should be hidden during the entirety of this scene, either hooded or merely not shown directly.

====Two====
In this scene [[Tuor]] should escape from the [[Easterlings]], introducing his lineage and the position of [[Men]].

====Three====
Here Tuor heads west, coming to [[Belegaer]]. He will eventually be whispered-to by a gull, a sort of messenger from Ulmo, and head south to Vinyamar. There he enters and discovers the armor, putting it on.

====Four====
In this scene Tuor exits Vinyamar to stand on the sands in front. As he does so, he spies storm-clouds westward over the sea, and hears thunder. Ulmo appears in all his majesty, with his horns calling, and charges him with a mission.

====Five====

==Conceptual Design==
Below shall be discussion for Conceptual Design, and below the discussion conceptual drawings.

Leitmotif code: Each normal letter signifies a quarter note, with ","s to seperate them into beats. "+" or "-" are added to show whether the following note is the one above or below it; a double of either of these shows that it is that note plus and octave. If there is a "/" between two regular notes, that shows both notes to be eighth-notes; double "/" shows them to be sixteenth, and so on. Half-notes are denoted when italicized, and whole notes when boldened. A connecting slur is denoted by "_", while a dot is ".". See below the example:

"Mary had a little lamb": E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, ''E'', -D, D, ''D'', +E, +G, ''G'', -E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, E, E, -D, D, +E, -D, '''-C'''.

===Persons===
====[[Tuor]]====
Tuor should be a rough-looking sort of man to begin with, but at the same time tall and lordly. Rather like the description of [[Aragorn II|Aragorn]], yet not quite so rugged and "in-tune" with the wild. He should always show a certain cleanliness, even when in the wilderness. After he enters Gondolin, he should be always dressed simply, generally in white and blue.

His leitmotif is somewhat wild and free, a little rustic, but tuneful. It also has a solid, low subtone that suggests nobility or royalty. Ideal instruments would be violin, harp, and/or whistle.

====[[Idril]]====
Idril generally wears, like her father, white and red, though occasionally blue and silver can be found in her outfits. Her hair is long and golden, reaching below her waist, often crowned with golden leaves or with a braid.

Idril's leitmotif is high but soft, probably in flutes, whistles, and/or a solo singer. It is probably the most romantic theme, yet not overly so. It remains soft and simple, without being rich and reinforced by a host of other instruments. Best compared to the [http://www.amazon.com/Braveheart-Original-Motion-Picture-Soundtrack/dp/B000004286/sr=8-1/qid=1165590369/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-5960899-5574333?ie=UTF8&s=music theme to Mel Gibson's ''Braveheart'' (see samples for tracks 2-4)].

====[[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]]====
Turgon is very tall and proud, grave of face; reflective and wise. Like his people, his garments are simple, though fine. He is often found in silver-gray or white, and his silver crown contains large red garnets. In great ceremonies he wears red and white, embroidered with gold, carrying a staff carved of white wood, with a gull carved on the end.

His leitmotif is very sturdy and regal. It relies much upon brass, perhaps French Horns or trumpets, playing slowly and solemnly. It also has a distinct tinge of sadness or wistfulness.

Idea leitmotif (3/4): E, ''+A'', +B, ''+C'', -A/+B, +C, +D. /-C, -B, -G, -D, ''+E'', +F#, ''+G'', +A/-G, -F#. /-E, -D, ''+E''

====[[Voronwë of Gondolin|Voronwë]]====

In the beginning Voronwë is dressed in simple gray; a loose tunic and brown belt. Later he wears blue and silver, but always somewhat simply, without jewelry and always loosely.

Voronwë's leitmotif is played ideally on pipes or harps, like the Sea theme but lower. It is wild and quiet, somewhat simple as well, with a tinge of wistfulness.

====[[Ulmo]]====

Ulmo appears as he is described, very strong, in shining mail. Despite his even bearing, he has a bit of wildness about him.

His theme, too, is similar to both the Valinor and Sea themes. It is a combination of whistles in a high, churning melody, and low, sweet strings and horns in a slow, regal and beautiful theme.

====Lords of Gondolin====

[[Glorfindel]] is light-hearted, but very powerful and fiery. [[Ecthelion of the Fountain|Ecthelion]] is more stoic, with quiet emotion and a cold but steady sword-arm. [[Rog]] is misshapen, and it is suggested that he was once tortured by Morgoth; he has a fierce hate of evil, and a love of his art of smithing. All others feature only as minor: [[Egalmoth]] and [[Galdor of the Tree|Galdor]] appear several times with speaking roles, [[Penlod]], [[Duilin of Gondolin|Duilin]], and possibly [[Salgant]] are relegated to a non-speaking (except possibly for several short phrases) background role.

Glorfindel's leitmotif would be played on the woodwinds; high and noble, but seeming never to be still, always active. Ecthelion's is more horns and flutes, a regal, tuneful theme with a tinge of sadness and solemnity. Rog's is deep, with drums and a suggestion of darkness and great anger.

:Rog leitmotif idea (bass clef): A, +C, -Bb, +E, -D, +E, -C, +D#, -A, +B
:Glorfindel leitmotif idea (upper clef, high register; steady A below): E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/-E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/+E/-C/-A/-E/E/+A, C

====[[Maeglin]]====

Maeglin is generally dressed in black embroidered with silver, never excessively ornamented. He should be handsome and dark-haired, but with a somewhat rough voice.

His leitmotif can be played either quick or slow depending on the situation. It is, in its way, beautiful; played either minor or major, with occasional twists and surprise movements, but steady. Possible instruments would be strings or woodwinds.

====Inhabitants of [[Gondolin]]====
In Gondolin it is accepted that weapons are not generally openly displayed, except for guards on duty or during special ceremonies. Men wear Roman-like tunics, but often longer and more robe-like. Women typically have long dresses similar to those in fashion in Medieval Europe in the 14th century, but looser and lighter of material. In ceremonies of importance both their robes are still simple (no elaborate layers decked with gems or anything like that), but embroidered with gold, silver, and other colors. Soldiers wear surcoats bearing the emblem of their house, beneath which is fish-scale mail.

===Places===
====[[Dor-Lómin]]====

Scandinavia.

====[[Gondolin]]====
Idea leitmotif (4/4): A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/-D, +F, -E, A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/+G, -F#, -D

=====[[Square of the King]]=====

A four-sided area on a raised portion near the center of the City of Gondolin. On the far side is the great white palace of King Turgon, with the high tower spiraling up from its center. On either side of the bronze doors of the palace is a tree, one of gold and one of silver ([[Glingal]] and [[Belthil]]). The space of their branches is great enough that a score of elves could sit in each of their boughs, and they are filled with many singing white birds. In the middle of the courtyard, however, is the main attraction: a great fountain, formed by a natural geyser coming from the earth. It shoots up twenty-seven fathoms in the air, seeming to be made of crystal rain. The courtyard is bordered by a low wall of white stone, from which one could look out on the whole city, and just inside the walls by many beautiful green trees, though far smaller in stature than Glingal and Belthil.

=====[[Square of the Folkwell]] (Gardens)=====

A place of light and beauty. The ground is laid by smooth white stone like marble, and great trees grow about them. The roots of the trees are planted each in a raised area of green, grassy earth, which are close enough together that the sunlight comes down in shafts through the branches. Each of the circles is about fourteen cubits in diameter. Some of the mallorns have buildings in their high bows. The trees form a sort of ring around the Folkwell, which is fully two fathoms across and nine fathoms deep clear. It is fed by a spring down at the bottom, and the excess water is piped off to feed the trees of the Square.

=====Hall of the Chronicle=====

Not found in Tolkien's works. The hall is long and white, with a high ceiling. Windows are found just below the ceiling, on a clerestory. The paintings of the history are unbroken, one painting shifting into the other, in bright colors of blue, red, gold, silver, etc., very much in the romantic style.

=====[[Gar Ainion]]=====

A place, again, of light and beauty, with an ephasis on gold, white, and green. It is regular in shape, with arches leaving it open to the winds. Trees grow around it, especially mallorns. Its stone is white and laced with vines, inlaid with intricate gold engravings of leaves and scenes of hunts and bliss in Valinor.

====[[Firth of Drengist]]====
Ideal filming locations would be Cathedral Caves in New Zealand or Cape Cove in Oregon. Both are very different, so it's one or the other. The description in ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]'' is of trees, white sands, and great cliffs beset with caverns and spoutholes.

====[[Vinyamar]]====

==References==
*[[The Fall of Gondolin]], [[Book of Lost Tales 2]]
*[[The Silmarillion]]
*[[Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin]]
__NOTOC__

Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor

2008-05-11T01:46:11Z

Maeglin:

'''Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor''' is the third chapter of the [[Quenta Silmarillion]] section within [[The Silmarillion]].

==Synopsis==
Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor tells of several instrumental events in the [[Legendarium]]. It begins with the [[Valar]] at war with [[Melkor]], who has sewn evil in Middle-Earth and built a great fortress [[Utumno]]. It speaks of the Valar primarily, as they ready Arda for the coming of the [[Firstborn]], the [[Elves]]. [[Tulkas]] makes war on Melkor while [[Varda]] prepares the world by placing the [[stars]] in the sky to guide the elves in the darkness of middle earth. All is prepared for the coming of the elves.

The next major event is Melkor's captivity. Melkor has built up great strenght in Utumno, and created [[orcs]] in mockery of the elves. This was said to be the most evil deed of Melkor. The War on Melkor is pressumedly won. Utumno is sacked, though Tolkien notes there are deeper and mighty vaults in the fortress that were unchecked, and so evil continued. Additionally one of the [[Maia]] who fell with Melko, [[Sauron]] Melkor's lieutenant, was not found and escaped. But Melko was found cowering in the depths of Utumno, and [[Aulë]] wrought chains to keep him in captivity.

The final major event of this chapter is the coming of the Elves, Firstborn of [[Ilúvatar]]. This actually takes place while the [[Battle of the Powers]] is happening, and so is silmotaneous rather than final. It is said, however, that the elves heard a great shaking and were worried but did not take part in the battle. The first elves are described to have greater stature than their desendants, but are just as fair. They marvel at nature, the stars, etc. This chapter not only describes the original thoughts of the elves and thier surroundings, but also the [[Great Journey]] and the sundering of the Elves. The Valar send servents to call them to [[Aman]]. The Elves embark on the journey across Middle Earth, save some who refuse, and are further called dark elves, or the [[Avari]]. The elves journey, and some fall off along the way, who are called the [[Teleri]]. They are sundered in many groups. The elves reach [[Beleriand]] by the sea. Here more Teleri stay, for their love of the ocean. Finally those who journey across the sea to Aman are called the [[Eldar]]. Some of the Teleri, too, reach Aman, and are guided by [[Swan boats]]. From here on the elves are sundered, and these divisions will come into play later.

== The Swan Ships of the Teleri ==
[[Image:Billy Mosig - Parting from Eressea.jpg]]

== Sundering of the Elves ==

Quendi
____________________|_______________________
| |
Calaquendi___ ___Moriquendi
| | | |
Eldar_____Teleri Teleri Avari
| |
Vanyar Noldor

==External links==
* [http://entmoot.tolkientrail.com/showthread.php?t=7291 Chapter discussion at Entmoot.com]
* [http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?t=13391 Chapter discussion at BarrowDowns.com]

== Chapters ==

{{silmarillion-chapters}}

Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor

2008-05-11T01:24:54Z

Maeglin: /* Synopsis */

'''Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor''' is the third chapter of the [[Quenta Silmarillion]] section within [[The Silmarillion]].

==Synopsis==
Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor tells of several instrumental events in the [[Legendarium]]. It begins with the [[Valar]] at war with [[Melkor]], who has sewn evil in Middle-Earth and built a great fortress [[Utumno]]. It speaks of the Valar primarily, as they ready Arda for the coming of the [[Firstborn]], the [[Elves]]. [[Tulkas]] makes war on Melkor while [[Varda]] prepares the world by placing the [[stars]] in the sky to guide the elves in the darkness of middle earth. All is prepared for the coming of the elves.

The next major event is Melkor's captivity. Melkor has built up great strenght in Utumno, and created [[orcs]] in mockery of the elves. This was said to be the most evil deed of Melkor. The War on Melkor is pressumedly won. Utumno is sacked, though Tolkien notes there are deeper and mighty vaults in the fortress that were unchecked, and so evil continued. Additionally one of the [[Maia]] who fell with Melko, [[Sauron]] Melkor's lieutenant, was not found and escaped. But Melko was found cowering in the depths of Utumno, and [[Aulë]] wrought chains to keep him in captivity.

The final major event of this chapter is the coming of the Elves, Firstborn of [[Illúvatar]]. This actually takes place while the [[War of the Powers]] is happening, and so is silmotaneous rather than final. It is said, however, that the elves heard a great shaking and were worried but did not take part in the battle. The first elves are described to have greater stature than their desendants, but are just as fair. They marvel at nature, the stars, etc. This chapter not only describes the original thoughts of the elves and thier surroundings, but also [[The Great Journey]] and the sundering of the Elves. The Valar send servents to call them to [[Aman]]. The Elves embark on the journey across Middle Earth, save some who refuse, and are further called dark elves, or the [[Avari]]. The elves journey, and some fall off along the way, who are called the [[Teleri]]. They are sundered in many groups. The elves reach [[Beleriand]] by the sea. Here more Teleri stay, for their love of the ocean. Finally those who journey across the sea to Aman are called the [[Eldar]]. Some of the Teleri, too, reach Aman, and are guided by [[Swan boats]]. From here on the elves are sundered, and these divisions will come into play later.

== The Swan Ships of the Teleri ==
[[Image:Billy Mosig - Parting from Eressea.jpg]]

== Sundering of the Elves ==

Quendi
____________________|_______________________
| |
Calaquendi___ ___Moriquendi
| | | |
Eldar_________Teleri Teleri Avari
| |
Vanyar Noldor

==External links==
* [http://entmoot.tolkientrail.com/showthread.php?t=7291 Chapter discussion at Entmoot.com]
* [http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?t=13391 Chapter discussion at BarrowDowns.com]

== Chapters ==

{{silmarillion-chapters}}

Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor

2008-05-10T22:56:30Z

Maeglin:

'''Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor''' is the third chapter of the [[Quenta Silmarillion]] section within [[The Silmarillion]].

==Synopsis==
Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor tells of several instrumental events in the [[Legendarium]]. It begins with the [[Valar]] at war with [[Melkor]], who has sewn evil in Middle-Earth and built a great fortress[[Utumno]]. It speaks of the Valar primarily, as they ready Arda for the coming of the [[Firstborn]], the [[Elves]]. [[Tulkas]] makes war on Melkor while [[Varda]] prepares the world by placing the [[stars]] in the sky to guide the elves in the darkness of middle earth. All is prepared for the coming of the elves.

The next major event is Melkor's captivity. Melkor has built up great strenght in Utumno, and created [[orcs]]in mockery of the elves. This was said to be the most evil deed of Melkor. The War on Melkor is pressumedly won. Utumno is sacked, though Tolkien notes there are deeper and mighty vaults in the fortress that were unchecked, and so evil continued. Additionally one of the [[Maia]] who fell with Melko, [[Sauron]] Melkor's lieutenant, was not found and escaped. But Melko was found cowering in the depths of Utumno, and [[Aüle]] wrought chains to keep him in captivity.

The final major event of this chapter is the coming of the Elves, Firstborn of [[Illúvatar]]. This actually takes place while the [[War of the Powers]] is happening, and so is silmotaneous rather than final. It is said, however, that the elves heard a great shaking and were worried but did not take part in the battle. The first elves are described to have greater stature than their desendants, but are just as fair. They marvel at nature, the stars, etc. This chapter not only describes the original thoughts of the elves and thier surroundings, but also [[The Great Journey]] and the sundering of the Elves. The Valar send servents to call them to [[Aman]]. The Elves embark on the journey across Middle Earth, save some who refuse, and are further called dark elves, or the [[Avari]]. The elves journey, and some fall off along the way, who are called the [[Teleri]]. They are sundered in many groups. The elves reach [[Beleriand]] by the sea. Here more Teleri stay, for their love of the ocean. Finally those who journey across the sea to Aman are called the [[Eldar]]. Some of the Teleri, too, reach Aman, and are guided by [[Swan boats]]. From here on the elves are sundered, and these divisions will come into play later.

== The Swan Ships of the Teleri ==
[[Image:Billy Mosig - Parting from Eressea.jpg]]

== Sundering of the Elves ==

Quendi
____________________|_______________________
| |
Calaquendi___ ___Moriquendi
| | | |
Eldar_________Teleri Teleri Avari
| |
Vanyar Noldor

==External links==
* [http://entmoot.tolkientrail.com/showthread.php?t=7291 Chapter discussion at Entmoot.com]
* [http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?t=13391 Chapter discussion at BarrowDowns.com]

== Chapters ==

{{silmarillion-chapters}}

Talk:Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor

2008-05-10T22:46:12Z

Maeglin:

just edited a bunch of this- is it too detailed?--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 18:46, 10 May 2008 (EDT)

Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor

2008-05-10T22:45:31Z

Maeglin:

'''Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor''' is the third chapter of the [[Quenta Silmarillion]] section within [[The Silmarillion]].

==Synopsis==
Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor tells of several instrumental events in the [[Legendarium]]. It begins with the [[Valar]] at war with [[Melkor]], who has sewn evil in Middle-Earth and built a great fortress[[Utumno]]. It speaks of the Valar primarily, as they ready Arda for the coming of the [[Firstborn]], the [[Elves]]. [[Tulkas]] makes war on Melkor while [[Varda]] prepares the world by placing the [[stars]] in the sky to guide the elves in the darkness of middle earth. All is prepared for the coming of the elves.

The next major event is Melkor's captivity. Melkor has built up great strenght in Utumno, and created [[orcs]]in mockery of the elves. This was said to be the most evil deed of Melkor. The War on Melkor is pressumedly won. Utumno is sacked, though Tolkien notes there are deeper and mighty vaults in the fortress that were unchecked, and so evil continued. Additionally one of the [[Maia]] who fell with Melko, [[Sauron]] Melkor's lieutenant, was not found and escaped. But Melko was found cowering in the depths of Utumno, and [[Aüle]] wrought chains to keep him in captivity.

The final major event of this chapter is the coming of the Elves, Firstborn of [[Illúvatar]]. This actually takes place while the [[War of the Powers]] is happening, and so is silmotaneous rather than final. It is said, however, that the elves heard a great shaking and were worried but did not take part in the battle. The first elves are described to have greater stature than their desendants, but are just as fair. They marvel at nature, the stars, etc. This chapter not only describes the original thoughts of the elves and thier surroundings, but also [[The Great Journey]] and the sundering of the Elves. The Valar send servents to call them to [[Aman]]. The Elves embark on the journey across Middle Earth, save some who refuse, and are further called dark elves, or the [[Avari]]. The elves journey, and some fall off along the way, who are called the [[Teleri]]. They are sundered in many groups. The elves reach [[Beleriand]] by the sea. Here more Teleri stay, for their love of the ocean. Finally those who journey across the sea to Aman are called the [[Eldar]]. Some of the Teleri, too, reach Aman, and are guided by [[Swan boats]]. From here on the elves are sundered, and these divisions will come into play later.

==External links==
* [http://entmoot.tolkientrail.com/showthread.php?t=7291 Chapter discussion at Entmoot.com]
* [http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?t=13391 Chapter discussion at BarrowDowns.com]

== Chapters ==

{{silmarillion-chapters}}

User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/Fall of Gondolin

2008-05-08T04:08:57Z

Maeglin: /* General Discussion */

Greetings! This is the screenplay for Tolkien's epic story, ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]''. The title "''Fall of Gondolin''" may or may not be kept. We may start the script either with [[Tuor]], or with [[Turgon]]'s building of [[Gondolin]], or with a certain "fictional" character who sees Turgon. Unlike the [[Lay of Leithian]] or the [[Narn i Chîn Húrin]], it is possible to insert a "fictional" character, that is one the writers made up, to put the story into more "story-like" form. The other option would be to center on Tuor himself.

As far as my own ideas for the general style of the production go, I believe this production would do well with a sort of poetic style. That is, a heavy emphasis on music and landscape, for instance. Also, the world will be revealed through Tuor's eyes; we see Gondolin for the first time at the same time he does, for instance. Discuss this screenplay below, and feel free to challenge anything if you see fit. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]]

==General Discussion==
General discussion below this line.

==Lords of Gondolin==

Should there be a scene (Such as a meeting) that would introduce the lords of gondolin systematically (as well as a couple integral names) to clarify things? Or would that complicate it- people that don't get it don't need to.

I think this also ties in with a couple general questions- is it better on the whole to add more and thus make it longer? Is it better to go into more detail?

== Maeglin subplot ==

Would it be worth it to add a minor subplot concerning Maeglin's upbringing? It would probably only be a few minutes and could intertwine with Tuor's youth, perhaps. Does that sound reasonable or am I just being irrational because I like Maeglin(thus my username)? At any rate I think it would be worth mentioning his past in order to set up his role.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 22:44, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

:Personally, I would prefer that the audience see Gondolin revealed through Tuor's eyes. I think a few brief flashbacks would be good as Maeglin's character is developed, but in my opinion there's no need to show bits of Maeglin's story alongside Tuor's. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:56, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

===Galdor's name===

Should we change Galdor's name? Because of how early in the legendarium he appears I should think it to be forgivable. The point is that I don't want people confusing Tuor's grandfather with this elf-lord (nor do I think Tolkien would, if he had ever rewritten the tale). In one scene I wrote Tuor as saying, "I am Tuor, son of Huor, son of Galdor, son of Hador." Galdor the elf-lord is a minor character, but he does appear at least once by name. A simple solution would be to just have Tuor say, "I am Tuor son of Huor, descendant of Hador." Or, we could change Galdor's name to something else (or even replace Galdor's role altogether with an "invented" character). What are your opinions? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:27, 21 December 2007 (EST)

:I kind of like the idea of just not mentioning his name, it doesn't confuse people and yet it doesn't go against what Tolkien wrote. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 12:04, 21 December 2007 (EST)

===Title Ideas===

* The White Citadel
* Gondolin
* The Hidden Rock/ Secrect City

==Questions/suggestions/comments==

===Scenes===

Synopsises below. You may add on ideas as you wish, directly after the synopsises under their own heading.

====One====
The prologue scene; in this scene, [[Ulmo]] will do a voiceover as [[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]] places the armor in [[Vinyamar]]. Ulmo should introduce Turgon's calling to Gondolin, and the promise of a messenger to herald the end. Turgon's face should be hidden during the entirety of this scene, either hooded or merely not shown directly.

====Two====
In this scene [[Tuor]] should escape from the [[Easterlings]], introducing his lineage and the position of [[Men]].

====Three====
Here Tuor heads west, coming to [[Belegaer]]. He will eventually be whispered-to by a gull, a sort of messenger from Ulmo, and head south to Vinyamar. There he enters and discovers the armor, putting it on.

====Four====
In this scene Tuor exits Vinyamar to stand on the sands in front. As he does so, he spies storm-clouds westward over the sea, and hears thunder. Ulmo appears in all his majesty, with his horns calling, and charges him with a mission.

====Five====

==Conceptual Design==
Below shall be discussion for Conceptual Design, and below the discussion conceptual drawings.

Leitmotif code: Each normal letter signifies a quarter note, with ","s to seperate them into beats. "+" or "-" are added to show whether the following note is the one above or below it; a double of either of these shows that it is that note plus and octave. If there is a "/" between two regular notes, that shows both notes to be eighth-notes; double "/" shows them to be sixteenth, and so on. Half-notes are denoted when italicized, and whole notes when boldened. A connecting slur is denoted by "_", while a dot is ".". See below the example:

"Mary had a little lamb": E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, ''E'', -D, D, ''D'', +E, +G, ''G'', -E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, E, E, -D, D, +E, -D, '''-C'''.

===Persons===
====[[Tuor]]====
Tuor should be a rough-looking sort of man to begin with, but at the same time tall and lordly. Rather like the description of [[Aragorn II|Aragorn]], yet not quite so rugged and "in-tune" with the wild. He should always show a certain cleanliness, even when in the wilderness. After he enters Gondolin, he should be always dressed simply, generally in white and blue.

His leitmotif is somewhat wild and free, a little rustic, but tuneful. It also has a solid, low subtone that suggests nobility or royalty. Ideal instruments would be violin, harp, and/or whistle.

====[[Idril]]====
Idril generally wears, like her father, white and red, though occasionally blue and silver can be found in her outfits. Her hair is long and golden, reaching below her waist, often crowned with golden leaves or with a braid.

Idril's leitmotif is high but soft, probably in flutes, whistles, and/or a solo singer. It is probably the most romantic theme, yet not overly so. It remains soft and simple, without being rich and reinforced by a host of other instruments. Best compared to the [http://www.amazon.com/Braveheart-Original-Motion-Picture-Soundtrack/dp/B000004286/sr=8-1/qid=1165590369/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-5960899-5574333?ie=UTF8&s=music theme to Mel Gibson's ''Braveheart'' (see samples for tracks 2-4)].

====[[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]]====
Turgon is very tall and proud, grave of face; reflective and wise. Like his people, his garments are simple, though fine. He is often found in silver-gray or white, and his silver crown contains large red garnets. In great ceremonies he wears red and white, embroidered with gold, carrying a staff carved of white wood, with a gull carved on the end.

His leitmotif is very sturdy and regal. It relies much upon brass, perhaps French Horns or trumpets, playing slowly and solemnly. It also has a distinct tinge of sadness or wistfulness.

Idea leitmotif (3/4): E, ''+A'', +B, ''+C'', -A/+B, +C, +D. /-C, -B, -G, -D, ''+E'', +F#, ''+G'', +A/-G, -F#. /-E, -D, ''+E''

====[[Voronwë of Gondolin|Voronwë]]====

In the beginning Voronwë is dressed in simple gray; a loose tunic and brown belt. Later he wears blue and silver, but always somewhat simply, without jewelry and always loosely.

Voronwë's leitmotif is played ideally on pipes or harps, like the Sea theme but lower. It is wild and quiet, somewhat simple as well, with a tinge of wistfulness.

====[[Ulmo]]====

Ulmo appears as he is described, very strong, in shining mail. Despite his even bearing, he has a bit of wildness about him.

His theme, too, is similar to both the Valinor and Sea themes. It is a combination of whistles in a high, churning melody, and low, sweet strings and horns in a slow, regal and beautiful theme.

====Lords of Gondolin====

[[Glorfindel]] is light-hearted, but very powerful and fiery. [[Ecthelion of the Fountain|Ecthelion]] is more stoic, with quiet emotion and a cold but steady sword-arm. [[Rog]] is misshapen, and it is suggested that he was once tortured by Morgoth; he has a fierce hate of evil, and a love of his art of smithing. All others feature only as minor: [[Egalmoth]] and [[Galdor of the Tree|Galdor]] appear several times with speaking roles, [[Penlod]], [[Duilin of Gondolin|Duilin]], and possibly [[Salgant]] are relegated to a non-speaking (except possibly for several short phrases) background role.

Glorfindel's leitmotif would be played on the woodwinds; high and noble, but seeming never to be still, always active. Ecthelion's is more horns and flutes, a regal, tuneful theme with a tinge of sadness and solemnity. Rog's is deep, with drums and a suggestion of darkness and great anger.

:Rog leitmotif idea (bass clef): A, +C, -Bb, +E, -D, +E, -C, +D#, -A, +B
:Glorfindel leitmotif idea (upper clef, high register; steady A below): E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/-E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/+E/-C/-A/-E/E/+A, C

====[[Maeglin]]====

Maeglin is generally dressed in black embroidered with silver, never excessively ornamented. He should be handsome and dark-haired, but with a somewhat rough voice.

His leitmotif can be played either quick or slow depending on the situation. It is, in its way, beautiful; played either minor or major, with occasional twists and surprise movements, but steady. Possible instruments would be strings or woodwinds.

====Inhabitants of [[Gondolin]]====
In Gondolin it is accepted that weapons are not generally openly displayed, except for guards on duty or during special ceremonies. Men wear Roman-like tunics, but often longer and more robe-like. Women typically have long dresses similar to those in fashion in Medieval Europe in the 14th century, but looser and lighter of material. In ceremonies of importance both their robes are still simple (no elaborate layers decked with gems or anything like that), but embroidered with gold, silver, and other colors. Soldiers wear surcoats bearing the emblem of their house, beneath which is fish-scale mail.

===Places===
====[[Dor-Lómin]]====

Scandinavia.

====[[Gondolin]]====
Idea leitmotif (4/4): A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/-D, +F, -E, A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/+G, -F#, -D

=====[[Square of the King]]=====

A four-sided area on a raised portion near the center of the City of Gondolin. On the far side is the great white palace of King Turgon, with the high tower spiraling up from its center. On either side of the bronze doors of the palace is a tree, one of gold and one of silver ([[Glingal]] and [[Belthil]]). The space of their branches is great enough that a score of elves could sit in each of their boughs, and they are filled with many singing white birds. In the middle of the courtyard, however, is the main attraction: a great fountain, formed by a natural geyser coming from the earth. It shoots up twenty-seven fathoms in the air, seeming to be made of crystal rain. The courtyard is bordered by a low wall of white stone, from which one could look out on the whole city, and just inside the walls by many beautiful green trees, though far smaller in stature than Glingal and Belthil.

=====[[Square of the Folkwell]] (Gardens)=====

A place of light and beauty. The ground is laid by smooth white stone like marble, and great trees grow about them. The roots of the trees are planted each in a raised area of green, grassy earth, which are close enough together that the sunlight comes down in shafts through the branches. Each of the circles is about fourteen cubits in diameter. Some of the mallorns have buildings in their high bows. The trees form a sort of ring around the Folkwell, which is fully two fathoms across and nine fathoms deep clear. It is fed by a spring down at the bottom, and the excess water is piped off to feed the trees of the Square.

=====Hall of the Chronicle=====

Not found in Tolkien's works. The hall is long and white, with a high ceiling. Windows are found just below the ceiling, on a clerestory. The paintings of the history are unbroken, one painting shifting into the other, in bright colors of blue, red, gold, silver, etc., very much in the romantic style.

=====[[Gar Ainion]]=====

A place, again, of light and beauty, with an ephasis on gold, white, and green. It is regular in shape, with arches leaving it open to the winds. Trees grow around it, especially mallorns. Its stone is white and laced with vines, inlaid with intricate gold engravings of leaves and scenes of hunts and bliss in Valinor.

====[[Firth of Drengist]]====
Ideal filming locations would be Cathedral Caves in New Zealand or Cape Cove in Oregon. Both are very different, so it's one or the other. The description in ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]'' is of trees, white sands, and great cliffs beset with caverns and spoutholes.

====[[Vinyamar]]====

==References==
*[[The Fall of Gondolin]], [[Book of Lost Tales 2]]
*[[The Silmarillion]]
*[[Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin]]
__NOTOC__

User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/Fall of Gondolin

2008-05-07T21:53:40Z

Maeglin: /* Turgon or Tuor? */

Greetings! This is the screenplay for Tolkien's epic story, ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]''. The title "''Fall of Gondolin''" may or may not be kept. We may start the script either with [[Tuor]], or with [[Turgon]]'s building of [[Gondolin]], or with a certain "fictional" character who sees Turgon. Unlike the [[Lay of Leithian]] or the [[Narn i Chîn Húrin]], it is possible to insert a "fictional" character, that is one the writers made up, to put the story into more "story-like" form. The other option would be to center on Tuor himself.

As far as my own ideas for the general style of the production go, I believe this production would do well with a sort of poetic style. That is, a heavy emphasis on music and landscape, for instance. Also, the world will be revealed through Tuor's eyes; we see Gondolin for the first time at the same time he does, for instance. Discuss this screenplay below, and feel free to challenge anything if you see fit. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]]

==General Discussion==
General discussion below this line.

== Maeglin subplot ==

Would it be worth it to add a minor subplot concerning Maeglin's upbringing? It would probably only be a few minutes and could intertwine with Tuor's youth, perhaps. Does that sound reasonable or am I just being irrational because I like Maeglin(thus my username)? At any rate I think it would be worth mentioning his past in order to set up his role.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 22:44, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

:Personally, I would prefer that the audience see Gondolin revealed through Tuor's eyes. I think a few brief flashbacks would be good as Maeglin's character is developed, but in my opinion there's no need to show bits of Maeglin's story alongside Tuor's. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:56, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

===Galdor's name===

Should we change Galdor's name? Because of how early in the legendarium he appears I should think it to be forgivable. The point is that I don't want people confusing Tuor's grandfather with this elf-lord (nor do I think Tolkien would, if he had ever rewritten the tale). In one scene I wrote Tuor as saying, "I am Tuor, son of Huor, son of Galdor, son of Hador." Galdor the elf-lord is a minor character, but he does appear at least once by name. A simple solution would be to just have Tuor say, "I am Tuor son of Huor, descendant of Hador." Or, we could change Galdor's name to something else (or even replace Galdor's role altogether with an "invented" character). What are your opinions? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:27, 21 December 2007 (EST)

:I kind of like the idea of just not mentioning his name, it doesn't confuse people and yet it doesn't go against what Tolkien wrote. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 12:04, 21 December 2007 (EST)

===Title Ideas===

* The White Citadel
* Gondolin
* The Hidden Rock/ Secrect City

==Questions/suggestions/comments==

===Scenes===

Synopsises below. You may add on ideas as you wish, directly after the synopsises under their own heading.

====One====
The prologue scene; in this scene, [[Ulmo]] will do a voiceover as [[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]] places the armor in [[Vinyamar]]. Ulmo should introduce Turgon's calling to Gondolin, and the promise of a messenger to herald the end. Turgon's face should be hidden during the entirety of this scene, either hooded or merely not shown directly.

====Two====
In this scene [[Tuor]] should escape from the [[Easterlings]], introducing his lineage and the position of [[Men]].

====Three====
Here Tuor heads west, coming to [[Belegaer]]. He will eventually be whispered-to by a gull, a sort of messenger from Ulmo, and head south to Vinyamar. There he enters and discovers the armor, putting it on.

====Four====
In this scene Tuor exits Vinyamar to stand on the sands in front. As he does so, he spies storm-clouds westward over the sea, and hears thunder. Ulmo appears in all his majesty, with his horns calling, and charges him with a mission.

====Five====

==Conceptual Design==
Below shall be discussion for Conceptual Design, and below the discussion conceptual drawings.

Leitmotif code: Each normal letter signifies a quarter note, with ","s to seperate them into beats. "+" or "-" are added to show whether the following note is the one above or below it; a double of either of these shows that it is that note plus and octave. If there is a "/" between two regular notes, that shows both notes to be eighth-notes; double "/" shows them to be sixteenth, and so on. Half-notes are denoted when italicized, and whole notes when boldened. A connecting slur is denoted by "_", while a dot is ".". See below the example:

"Mary had a little lamb": E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, ''E'', -D, D, ''D'', +E, +G, ''G'', -E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, E, E, -D, D, +E, -D, '''-C'''.

===Persons===
====[[Tuor]]====
Tuor should be a rough-looking sort of man to begin with, but at the same time tall and lordly. Rather like the description of [[Aragorn II|Aragorn]], yet not quite so rugged and "in-tune" with the wild. He should always show a certain cleanliness, even when in the wilderness. After he enters Gondolin, he should be always dressed simply, generally in white and blue.

His leitmotif is somewhat wild and free, a little rustic, but tuneful. It also has a solid, low subtone that suggests nobility or royalty. Ideal instruments would be violin, harp, and/or whistle.

====[[Idril]]====
Idril generally wears, like her father, white and red, though occasionally blue and silver can be found in her outfits. Her hair is long and golden, reaching below her waist, often crowned with golden leaves or with a braid.

Idril's leitmotif is high but soft, probably in flutes, whistles, and/or a solo singer. It is probably the most romantic theme, yet not overly so. It remains soft and simple, without being rich and reinforced by a host of other instruments. Best compared to the [http://www.amazon.com/Braveheart-Original-Motion-Picture-Soundtrack/dp/B000004286/sr=8-1/qid=1165590369/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-5960899-5574333?ie=UTF8&s=music theme to Mel Gibson's ''Braveheart'' (see samples for tracks 2-4)].

====[[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]]====
Turgon is very tall and proud, grave of face; reflective and wise. Like his people, his garments are simple, though fine. He is often found in silver-gray or white, and his silver crown contains large red garnets. In great ceremonies he wears red and white, embroidered with gold, carrying a staff carved of white wood, with a gull carved on the end.

His leitmotif is very sturdy and regal. It relies much upon brass, perhaps French Horns or trumpets, playing slowly and solemnly. It also has a distinct tinge of sadness or wistfulness.

Idea leitmotif (3/4): E, ''+A'', +B, ''+C'', -A/+B, +C, +D. /-C, -B, -G, -D, ''+E'', +F#, ''+G'', +A/-G, -F#. /-E, -D, ''+E''

====[[Voronwë of Gondolin|Voronwë]]====

In the beginning Voronwë is dressed in simple gray; a loose tunic and brown belt. Later he wears blue and silver, but always somewhat simply, without jewelry and always loosely.

Voronwë's leitmotif is played ideally on pipes or harps, like the Sea theme but lower. It is wild and quiet, somewhat simple as well, with a tinge of wistfulness.

====[[Ulmo]]====

Ulmo appears as he is described, very strong, in shining mail. Despite his even bearing, he has a bit of wildness about him.

His theme, too, is similar to both the Valinor and Sea themes. It is a combination of whistles in a high, churning melody, and low, sweet strings and horns in a slow, regal and beautiful theme.

====Lords of Gondolin====

[[Glorfindel]] is light-hearted, but very powerful and fiery. [[Ecthelion of the Fountain|Ecthelion]] is more stoic, with quiet emotion and a cold but steady sword-arm. [[Rog]] is misshapen, and it is suggested that he was once tortured by Morgoth; he has a fierce hate of evil, and a love of his art of smithing. All others feature only as minor: [[Egalmoth]] and [[Galdor of the Tree|Galdor]] appear several times with speaking roles, [[Penlod]], [[Duilin of Gondolin|Duilin]], and possibly [[Salgant]] are relegated to a non-speaking (except possibly for several short phrases) background role.

Glorfindel's leitmotif would be played on the woodwinds; high and noble, but seeming never to be still, always active. Ecthelion's is more horns and flutes, a regal, tuneful theme with a tinge of sadness and solemnity. Rog's is deep, with drums and a suggestion of darkness and great anger.

:Rog leitmotif idea (bass clef): A, +C, -Bb, +E, -D, +E, -C, +D#, -A, +B
:Glorfindel leitmotif idea (upper clef, high register; steady A below): E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/-E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/+E/-C/-A/-E/E/+A, C

====[[Maeglin]]====

Maeglin is generally dressed in black embroidered with silver, never excessively ornamented. He should be handsome and dark-haired, but with a somewhat rough voice.

His leitmotif can be played either quick or slow depending on the situation. It is, in its way, beautiful; played either minor or major, with occasional twists and surprise movements, but steady. Possible instruments would be strings or woodwinds.

====Inhabitants of [[Gondolin]]====
In Gondolin it is accepted that weapons are not generally openly displayed, except for guards on duty or during special ceremonies. Men wear Roman-like tunics, but often longer and more robe-like. Women typically have long dresses similar to those in fashion in Medieval Europe in the 14th century, but looser and lighter of material. In ceremonies of importance both their robes are still simple (no elaborate layers decked with gems or anything like that), but embroidered with gold, silver, and other colors. Soldiers wear surcoats bearing the emblem of their house, beneath which is fish-scale mail.

===Places===
====[[Dor-Lómin]]====

Scandinavia.

====[[Gondolin]]====
Idea leitmotif (4/4): A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/-D, +F, -E, A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/+G, -F#, -D

=====[[Square of the King]]=====

A four-sided area on a raised portion near the center of the City of Gondolin. On the far side is the great white palace of King Turgon, with the high tower spiraling up from its center. On either side of the bronze doors of the palace is a tree, one of gold and one of silver ([[Glingal]] and [[Belthil]]). The space of their branches is great enough that a score of elves could sit in each of their boughs, and they are filled with many singing white birds. In the middle of the courtyard, however, is the main attraction: a great fountain, formed by a natural geyser coming from the earth. It shoots up twenty-seven fathoms in the air, seeming to be made of crystal rain. The courtyard is bordered by a low wall of white stone, from which one could look out on the whole city, and just inside the walls by many beautiful green trees, though far smaller in stature than Glingal and Belthil.

=====[[Square of the Folkwell]] (Gardens)=====

A place of light and beauty. The ground is laid by smooth white stone like marble, and great trees grow about them. The roots of the trees are planted each in a raised area of green, grassy earth, which are close enough together that the sunlight comes down in shafts through the branches. Each of the circles is about fourteen cubits in diameter. Some of the mallorns have buildings in their high bows. The trees form a sort of ring around the Folkwell, which is fully two fathoms across and nine fathoms deep clear. It is fed by a spring down at the bottom, and the excess water is piped off to feed the trees of the Square.

=====Hall of the Chronicle=====

Not found in Tolkien's works. The hall is long and white, with a high ceiling. Windows are found just below the ceiling, on a clerestory. The paintings of the history are unbroken, one painting shifting into the other, in bright colors of blue, red, gold, silver, etc., very much in the romantic style.

=====[[Gar Ainion]]=====

A place, again, of light and beauty, with an ephasis on gold, white, and green. It is regular in shape, with arches leaving it open to the winds. Trees grow around it, especially mallorns. Its stone is white and laced with vines, inlaid with intricate gold engravings of leaves and scenes of hunts and bliss in Valinor.

====[[Firth of Drengist]]====
Ideal filming locations would be Cathedral Caves in New Zealand or Cape Cove in Oregon. Both are very different, so it's one or the other. The description in ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]'' is of trees, white sands, and great cliffs beset with caverns and spoutholes.

====[[Vinyamar]]====

==References==
*[[The Fall of Gondolin]], [[Book of Lost Tales 2]]
*[[The Silmarillion]]
*[[Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin]]
__NOTOC__

User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/The Lay of Leithian

2008-05-04T19:14:37Z

Maeglin: /* Questions/suggestions/comments */

Anyone interested in this project should look here. Firstly, there are several tasks. The first is to decide a name, as we would if this were going to be a real movie. "Lay of Leithian" would ''not'' work, for reasons that should be obvious. Other ideas are listed below. You can add them as you like.

===Title Ideas===

*Beren and Lúthien
*Beren and the Two Jewels (''pertaining to Lúthien and the Silmaril'')
*Quest for the Silmaril
*Fairest (''refering to Lúthien'')

Now, there should probably be a prologue of introduction. Some ideas are listed below. Add ideas as you like.

===Prologue Ideas===

*[[Bilbo]]/[[Rúmil]]/??? takes down a book and begins to read
*There is shown a shot like the opening of the movie National Treasure, showing a brief history of the elves, shifting from one event to another with a narrator in the background

==Questions/suggestions/comments==

== Purist's introduction... ==

I know that Tolkien wrote the Tale of Tinuviel in story form, as well as the Lay of Lethian, but would the narrating thing come off a little corny or would it be better to stick to purism? Additionally not all of the information is entirely necessary and it may be better to keep from confustion...--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 15:14, 4 May 2008 (EDT)

===Canto → Chapter===

Since Tolkien did not finish his lay, and as Canto is probably an incorrect word anyway, I am dividing up the book into Chapters, listed below. You may add on ideas as you wish.

====One====
This chapter, after the prologue, gives a brief glimpse of the lives of the outlaws, and has Beren leave on a scouting mission. Then it recounts the betrayal and Beren's return and grief. It ends at the swearing of his oath and burying of his father.

====Two====
This chapter shall include things only glanced over in the book and lay, besides Beren's recapture of his ring. This shall include his traversing the dangerous [[Ered Gorgoroth]], and finishes when he ends up in [[Doriath]].

: In this section, isn't it a little strange how Beren talks to himself (for example "One of the Chilren of Ungoliant! I must get away from here!"
I don't mean to put down anyone's writing or anything, but it seems a tad strange. Please correct me if I am wrong, since I havn't read the version in the Lay of Lethian, but I think it could be represented differently...--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 15:14, 4 May 2008 (EDT)

====Three====
Here we give insight into the life of Lúthien, Daeron, Thingol, and Melian. We really need this, if it is not in the book. I personally don't favor a basic recounting, but rather a short piece that introduces the relationship of Thingol and Melian, the love of Daeron for Lúthien, and etc.

Specific scene ideas:

*Luthien and Daeron singing/playing music together in the forest. I think dialogue that reflects Daeron's adoration of Luthien, and possibly her discomfort about that, would go well.

:I had a thought. Perhaps we should introduce Daeron as a bit more than a minor character? I think he would be good as a secondary character. Perhaps we could introduce Lúthien through Daeron, rather than the other way around. It is probably a bad idea, but it might work depending on the direction that this screenplay is going. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 18:34, 21 December 2006 (EST)

*Thingol's overprotectiveness of Luthien playing out-- maybe her asking to go somewhere outside the Girdle of Melian and him loudly refusing-- though Luthien's nature would have to be concieved beforehand (whether she's adventurous, or just content to stay in Doriath.)

:Overprotectiveness? Protectiveness, perhaps. But I don't believe Thingol allowed anyone in his realm to go outside the Girdle without special permission. The main reason against Lúthien asking permission is that she would have no reason. Doriath was like a beleagured fortress; there were enemies on all sides for many miles around. What is more, Lúthien has dwelt there for hundreds of years. She would surely know the disposition of Thingol as to that option. Still, it would be good to show Thingol's love and protectiveness of her, so let's persue this discussion. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 18:34, 21 December 2006 (EST)

*Thingol's dislike of the Noldor; Melian's wisdom, keeping relations between her husband and the other Noldor in surrounding realms at least neutral. Maybe to explain the Girdle of Melian and those barred, a scene of some Noldorin Elves or orcs or mortals getting lost among the threshold.

*The relationship between Galadriel and Luthien-- it would be a cool little Easter egg for those who liked LotR to see Galadriel in her younger, pre-Lothlorien years.

:Galadriel wasn't in Doriath at this time, was she? If she was, I think this is a fine idea, so long as Galadriel didn't take over as a primary (or even secondary) character. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 18:34, 21 December 2006 (EST)

==General Discussion==
General Discussion should go beneath this title.

==Conceptual Design==
Below shall be discussion for Conceptual Design, and below the discussion conceptual drawings.

===[[Barahir son of Bregor|Barahir]]===

Barahir should be a deep-voiced man clad in green and brown, with a short black beard.

===[[Beren Erchamion]]===

===[[Sauron]]===

Sauron, as Lord of [[Werewolves]], I would imagine him in black armor with a wolf-skin draped over his back. His face should be sharp and cruel, though handsome, his voice cold but steady and evil, sharp as a knife.

===[[Lúthien]]===
Lúthien should, most definitely, be very beautiful (fairest of all children of Ilúvitar). She has long, "shadowy" dark hair, and grey eyes (though they can be grey/blue). She is slender and tall, with a pale face and graceful bearing. Keep in mind, she has to look very ethereal; Beren coming upon her sees her as some sort of goddess, and she has elven power enough to enchant Huan, Beren, Sauron, and Morgoth.

===[[Melian]]===
Very much like Lúthien; older, but still very beautiful. I imagine her as very regal, straight-- but kindly, and soft enough to intervene with Thingol.

===[[Thingol]]===

Thingol is tall and handsome, with a nose like those of Roman emperors, and eyes beneath dark brows. His hands are large, and in them he constantly clutches a staff with a leaf design at the top. His movements are slow and controlled, and it is only in his eyes and voice can it be told when he is angry. He tends to wear gray, and his crown is silver, though his vambraces and the trim to his clothes are a somber shade of green.

===[[Morgoth Bauglir]]===

===[[Finrod Felagund]]===

Finrod is tall and handsome, with long golden hair, and a face that is naturally filled with mirth. Though his bearing is steady and regal, his eyes are merry, and his voice is kind and hospitable.

===[[Doriath]]===

===[[Nargothrond]]===

===[[Angband]] and Morgoth's chamber===

Like Menegroth, only black and corrupt.

== Screenplay extension ==

There is a [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/ScreenPlay_Extension Screenlay Extension] available for MediaWiki, should I give a go at installing it? Should be fairly easy to implement but it's up to you guys. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 19:48, 14 August 2006 (EDT)

:Looks good to me. I'd say do it. By the way, I discovered [http://www.uib.no/People/hnohf/num-intro.htm this] by [[Helge Fauskanger]]. Very interesting, and he brings forth strong arguments. Enough that I am convinced. And his sub-screenplay is well-worked out as well. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 16:25, 1 September 2006 (EDT)

==Morgoth==
By the way, Sauron wouldn't refer to him as "Morgoth" but rather as "Melkor." Morgoth was the name the elves gave to Melkor. {{unsigned|63.162.143.21}}

User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/Fall of Gondolin

2008-05-01T00:43:51Z

Maeglin: /* Title Ideas */

Greetings! This is the screenplay for Tolkien's epic story, ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]''. The title "''Fall of Gondolin''" may or may not be kept. We may start the script either with [[Tuor]], or with [[Turgon]]'s building of [[Gondolin]], or with a certain "fictional" character who sees Turgon. Unlike the [[Lay of Leithian]] or the [[Narn i Chîn Húrin]], it is possible to insert a "fictional" character, that is one the writers made up, to put the story into more "story-like" form. The other option would be to center on Tuor himself.

As far as my own ideas for the general style of the production go, I believe this production would do well with a sort of poetic style. That is, a heavy emphasis on music and landscape, for instance. Also, the world will be revealed through Tuor's eyes; we see Gondolin for the first time at the same time he does, for instance. Discuss this screenplay below, and feel free to challenge anything if you see fit. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]]

==General Discussion==
General discussion below this line.

==Turgon or Tuor?==

Will this only show what happens to Tuor or will it include things like Gondolin coming forth in the battle of Unnumbered Tears? (sort of following Turgon and the gloy-days of Gondolin?)
Sorry if I sound irrelevent, I haven't read the Second Book of Lost Tales (yet!)so I don't know what that specifically covers, I'm still getting up to date on how everything works here.

== Maeglin subplot ==

Would it be worth it to add a minor subplot concerning Maeglin's upbringing? It would probably only be a few minutes and could intertwine with Tuor's youth, perhaps. Does that sound reasonable or am I just being irrational because I like Maeglin(thus my username)? At any rate I think it would be worth mentioning his past in order to set up his role.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 22:44, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

:Personally, I would prefer that the audience see Gondolin revealed through Tuor's eyes. I think a few brief flashbacks would be good as Maeglin's character is developed, but in my opinion there's no need to show bits of Maeglin's story alongside Tuor's. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:56, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

===Galdor's name===

Should we change Galdor's name? Because of how early in the legendarium he appears I should think it to be forgivable. The point is that I don't want people confusing Tuor's grandfather with this elf-lord (nor do I think Tolkien would, if he had ever rewritten the tale). In one scene I wrote Tuor as saying, "I am Tuor, son of Huor, son of Galdor, son of Hador." Galdor the elf-lord is a minor character, but he does appear at least once by name. A simple solution would be to just have Tuor say, "I am Tuor son of Huor, descendant of Hador." Or, we could change Galdor's name to something else (or even replace Galdor's role altogether with an "invented" character). What are your opinions? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:27, 21 December 2007 (EST)

:I kind of like the idea of just not mentioning his name, it doesn't confuse people and yet it doesn't go against what Tolkien wrote. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 12:04, 21 December 2007 (EST)

===Title Ideas===

* The White Citadel
* Gondolin
* The Hidden Rock/ Secrect City

==Questions/suggestions/comments==

===Scenes===

Synopsises below. You may add on ideas as you wish, directly after the synopsises under their own heading.

====One====
The prologue scene; in this scene, [[Ulmo]] will do a voiceover as [[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]] places the armor in [[Vinyamar]]. Ulmo should introduce Turgon's calling to Gondolin, and the promise of a messenger to herald the end. Turgon's face should be hidden during the entirety of this scene, either hooded or merely not shown directly.

====Two====
In this scene [[Tuor]] should escape from the [[Easterlings]], introducing his lineage and the position of [[Men]].

====Three====
Here Tuor heads west, coming to [[Belegaer]]. He will eventually be whispered-to by a gull, a sort of messenger from Ulmo, and head south to Vinyamar. There he enters and discovers the armor, putting it on.

====Four====
In this scene Tuor exits Vinyamar to stand on the sands in front. As he does so, he spies storm-clouds westward over the sea, and hears thunder. Ulmo appears in all his majesty, with his horns calling, and charges him with a mission.

====Five====

==Conceptual Design==
Below shall be discussion for Conceptual Design, and below the discussion conceptual drawings.

Leitmotif code: Each normal letter signifies a quarter note, with ","s to seperate them into beats. "+" or "-" are added to show whether the following note is the one above or below it; a double of either of these shows that it is that note plus and octave. If there is a "/" between two regular notes, that shows both notes to be eighth-notes; double "/" shows them to be sixteenth, and so on. Half-notes are denoted when italicized, and whole notes when boldened. A connecting slur is denoted by "_", while a dot is ".". See below the example:

"Mary had a little lamb": E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, ''E'', -D, D, ''D'', +E, +G, ''G'', -E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, E, E, -D, D, +E, -D, '''-C'''.

===Persons===
====[[Tuor]]====
Tuor should be a rough-looking sort of man to begin with, but at the same time tall and lordly. Rather like the description of [[Aragorn II|Aragorn]], yet not quite so rugged and "in-tune" with the wild. He should always show a certain cleanliness, even when in the wilderness. After he enters Gondolin, he should be always dressed simply, generally in white and blue.

His leitmotif is somewhat wild and free, a little rustic, but tuneful. It also has a solid, low subtone that suggests nobility or royalty. Ideal instruments would be violin, harp, and/or whistle.

====[[Idril]]====
Idril generally wears, like her father, white and red, though occasionally blue and silver can be found in her outfits. Her hair is long and golden, reaching below her waist, often crowned with golden leaves or with a braid.

Idril's leitmotif is high but soft, probably in flutes, whistles, and/or a solo singer. It is probably the most romantic theme, yet not overly so. It remains soft and simple, without being rich and reinforced by a host of other instruments. Best compared to the [http://www.amazon.com/Braveheart-Original-Motion-Picture-Soundtrack/dp/B000004286/sr=8-1/qid=1165590369/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-5960899-5574333?ie=UTF8&s=music theme to Mel Gibson's ''Braveheart'' (see samples for tracks 2-4)].

====[[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]]====
Turgon is very tall and proud, grave of face; reflective and wise. Like his people, his garments are simple, though fine. He is often found in silver-gray or white, and his silver crown contains large red garnets. In great ceremonies he wears red and white, embroidered with gold, carrying a staff carved of white wood, with a gull carved on the end.

His leitmotif is very sturdy and regal. It relies much upon brass, perhaps French Horns or trumpets, playing slowly and solemnly. It also has a distinct tinge of sadness or wistfulness.

Idea leitmotif (3/4): E, ''+A'', +B, ''+C'', -A/+B, +C, +D. /-C, -B, -G, -D, ''+E'', +F#, ''+G'', +A/-G, -F#. /-E, -D, ''+E''

====[[Voronwë of Gondolin|Voronwë]]====

In the beginning Voronwë is dressed in simple gray; a loose tunic and brown belt. Later he wears blue and silver, but always somewhat simply, without jewelry and always loosely.

Voronwë's leitmotif is played ideally on pipes or harps, like the Sea theme but lower. It is wild and quiet, somewhat simple as well, with a tinge of wistfulness.

====[[Ulmo]]====

Ulmo appears as he is described, very strong, in shining mail. Despite his even bearing, he has a bit of wildness about him.

His theme, too, is similar to both the Valinor and Sea themes. It is a combination of whistles in a high, churning melody, and low, sweet strings and horns in a slow, regal and beautiful theme.

====Lords of Gondolin====

[[Glorfindel]] is light-hearted, but very powerful and fiery. [[Ecthelion of the Fountain|Ecthelion]] is more stoic, with quiet emotion and a cold but steady sword-arm. [[Rog]] is misshapen, and it is suggested that he was once tortured by Morgoth; he has a fierce hate of evil, and a love of his art of smithing. All others feature only as minor: [[Egalmoth]] and [[Galdor of the Tree|Galdor]] appear several times with speaking roles, [[Penlod]], [[Duilin of Gondolin|Duilin]], and possibly [[Salgant]] are relegated to a non-speaking (except possibly for several short phrases) background role.

Glorfindel's leitmotif would be played on the woodwinds; high and noble, but seeming never to be still, always active. Ecthelion's is more horns and flutes, a regal, tuneful theme with a tinge of sadness and solemnity. Rog's is deep, with drums and a suggestion of darkness and great anger.

:Rog leitmotif idea (bass clef): A, +C, -Bb, +E, -D, +E, -C, +D#, -A, +B
:Glorfindel leitmotif idea (upper clef, high register; steady A below): E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/-E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/+E/-C/-A/-E/E/+A, C

====[[Maeglin]]====

Maeglin is generally dressed in black embroidered with silver, never excessively ornamented. He should be handsome and dark-haired, but with a somewhat rough voice.

His leitmotif can be played either quick or slow depending on the situation. It is, in its way, beautiful; played either minor or major, with occasional twists and surprise movements, but steady. Possible instruments would be strings or woodwinds.

====Inhabitants of [[Gondolin]]====
In Gondolin it is accepted that weapons are not generally openly displayed, except for guards on duty or during special ceremonies. Men wear Roman-like tunics, but often longer and more robe-like. Women typically have long dresses similar to those in fashion in Medieval Europe in the 14th century, but looser and lighter of material. In ceremonies of importance both their robes are still simple (no elaborate layers decked with gems or anything like that), but embroidered with gold, silver, and other colors. Soldiers wear surcoats bearing the emblem of their house, beneath which is fish-scale mail.

===Places===
====[[Dor-Lómin]]====

Scandinavia.

====[[Gondolin]]====
Idea leitmotif (4/4): A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/-D, +F, -E, A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/+G, -F#, -D

=====[[Square of the King]]=====

A four-sided area on a raised portion near the center of the City of Gondolin. On the far side is the great white palace of King Turgon, with the high tower spiraling up from its center. On either side of the bronze doors of the palace is a tree, one of gold and one of silver ([[Glingal]] and [[Belthil]]). The space of their branches is great enough that a score of elves could sit in each of their boughs, and they are filled with many singing white birds. In the middle of the courtyard, however, is the main attraction: a great fountain, formed by a natural geyser coming from the earth. It shoots up twenty-seven fathoms in the air, seeming to be made of crystal rain. The courtyard is bordered by a low wall of white stone, from which one could look out on the whole city, and just inside the walls by many beautiful green trees, though far smaller in stature than Glingal and Belthil.

=====[[Square of the Folkwell]] (Gardens)=====

A place of light and beauty. The ground is laid by smooth white stone like marble, and great trees grow about them. The roots of the trees are planted each in a raised area of green, grassy earth, which are close enough together that the sunlight comes down in shafts through the branches. Each of the circles is about fourteen cubits in diameter. Some of the mallorns have buildings in their high bows. The trees form a sort of ring around the Folkwell, which is fully two fathoms across and nine fathoms deep clear. It is fed by a spring down at the bottom, and the excess water is piped off to feed the trees of the Square.

=====Hall of the Chronicle=====

Not found in Tolkien's works. The hall is long and white, with a high ceiling. Windows are found just below the ceiling, on a clerestory. The paintings of the history are unbroken, one painting shifting into the other, in bright colors of blue, red, gold, silver, etc., very much in the romantic style.

=====[[Gar Ainion]]=====

A place, again, of light and beauty, with an ephasis on gold, white, and green. It is regular in shape, with arches leaving it open to the winds. Trees grow around it, especially mallorns. Its stone is white and laced with vines, inlaid with intricate gold engravings of leaves and scenes of hunts and bliss in Valinor.

====[[Firth of Drengist]]====
Ideal filming locations would be Cathedral Caves in New Zealand or Cape Cove in Oregon. Both are very different, so it's one or the other. The description in ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]'' is of trees, white sands, and great cliffs beset with caverns and spoutholes.

====[[Vinyamar]]====

==References==
*[[The Fall of Gondolin]], [[Book of Lost Tales 2]]
*[[The Silmarillion]]
*[[Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin]]
__NOTOC__

User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/Fall of Gondolin

2008-05-01T00:38:26Z

Maeglin: /* General Discussion */

Greetings! This is the screenplay for Tolkien's epic story, ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]''. The title "''Fall of Gondolin''" may or may not be kept. We may start the script either with [[Tuor]], or with [[Turgon]]'s building of [[Gondolin]], or with a certain "fictional" character who sees Turgon. Unlike the [[Lay of Leithian]] or the [[Narn i Chîn Húrin]], it is possible to insert a "fictional" character, that is one the writers made up, to put the story into more "story-like" form. The other option would be to center on Tuor himself.

As far as my own ideas for the general style of the production go, I believe this production would do well with a sort of poetic style. That is, a heavy emphasis on music and landscape, for instance. Also, the world will be revealed through Tuor's eyes; we see Gondolin for the first time at the same time he does, for instance. Discuss this screenplay below, and feel free to challenge anything if you see fit. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]]

==General Discussion==
General discussion below this line.

==Turgon or Tuor?==

Will this only show what happens to Tuor or will it include things like Gondolin coming forth in the battle of Unnumbered Tears? (sort of following Turgon and the gloy-days of Gondolin?)
Sorry if I sound irrelevent, I haven't read the Second Book of Lost Tales (yet!)so I don't know what that specifically covers, I'm still getting up to date on how everything works here.

== Maeglin subplot ==

Would it be worth it to add a minor subplot concerning Maeglin's upbringing? It would probably only be a few minutes and could intertwine with Tuor's youth, perhaps. Does that sound reasonable or am I just being irrational because I like Maeglin(thus my username)? At any rate I think it would be worth mentioning his past in order to set up his role.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 22:44, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

:Personally, I would prefer that the audience see Gondolin revealed through Tuor's eyes. I think a few brief flashbacks would be good as Maeglin's character is developed, but in my opinion there's no need to show bits of Maeglin's story alongside Tuor's. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:56, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

===Galdor's name===

Should we change Galdor's name? Because of how early in the legendarium he appears I should think it to be forgivable. The point is that I don't want people confusing Tuor's grandfather with this elf-lord (nor do I think Tolkien would, if he had ever rewritten the tale). In one scene I wrote Tuor as saying, "I am Tuor, son of Huor, son of Galdor, son of Hador." Galdor the elf-lord is a minor character, but he does appear at least once by name. A simple solution would be to just have Tuor say, "I am Tuor son of Huor, descendant of Hador." Or, we could change Galdor's name to something else (or even replace Galdor's role altogether with an "invented" character). What are your opinions? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:27, 21 December 2007 (EST)

:I kind of like the idea of just not mentioning his name, it doesn't confuse people and yet it doesn't go against what Tolkien wrote. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 12:04, 21 December 2007 (EST)

===Title Ideas===

* The White Citadel
* Gondolin

==Questions/suggestions/comments==

===Scenes===

Synopsises below. You may add on ideas as you wish, directly after the synopsises under their own heading.

====One====
The prologue scene; in this scene, [[Ulmo]] will do a voiceover as [[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]] places the armor in [[Vinyamar]]. Ulmo should introduce Turgon's calling to Gondolin, and the promise of a messenger to herald the end. Turgon's face should be hidden during the entirety of this scene, either hooded or merely not shown directly.

====Two====
In this scene [[Tuor]] should escape from the [[Easterlings]], introducing his lineage and the position of [[Men]].

====Three====
Here Tuor heads west, coming to [[Belegaer]]. He will eventually be whispered-to by a gull, a sort of messenger from Ulmo, and head south to Vinyamar. There he enters and discovers the armor, putting it on.

====Four====
In this scene Tuor exits Vinyamar to stand on the sands in front. As he does so, he spies storm-clouds westward over the sea, and hears thunder. Ulmo appears in all his majesty, with his horns calling, and charges him with a mission.

====Five====

==Conceptual Design==
Below shall be discussion for Conceptual Design, and below the discussion conceptual drawings.

Leitmotif code: Each normal letter signifies a quarter note, with ","s to seperate them into beats. "+" or "-" are added to show whether the following note is the one above or below it; a double of either of these shows that it is that note plus and octave. If there is a "/" between two regular notes, that shows both notes to be eighth-notes; double "/" shows them to be sixteenth, and so on. Half-notes are denoted when italicized, and whole notes when boldened. A connecting slur is denoted by "_", while a dot is ".". See below the example:

"Mary had a little lamb": E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, ''E'', -D, D, ''D'', +E, +G, ''G'', -E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, E, E, -D, D, +E, -D, '''-C'''.

===Persons===
====[[Tuor]]====
Tuor should be a rough-looking sort of man to begin with, but at the same time tall and lordly. Rather like the description of [[Aragorn II|Aragorn]], yet not quite so rugged and "in-tune" with the wild. He should always show a certain cleanliness, even when in the wilderness. After he enters Gondolin, he should be always dressed simply, generally in white and blue.

His leitmotif is somewhat wild and free, a little rustic, but tuneful. It also has a solid, low subtone that suggests nobility or royalty. Ideal instruments would be violin, harp, and/or whistle.

====[[Idril]]====
Idril generally wears, like her father, white and red, though occasionally blue and silver can be found in her outfits. Her hair is long and golden, reaching below her waist, often crowned with golden leaves or with a braid.

Idril's leitmotif is high but soft, probably in flutes, whistles, and/or a solo singer. It is probably the most romantic theme, yet not overly so. It remains soft and simple, without being rich and reinforced by a host of other instruments. Best compared to the [http://www.amazon.com/Braveheart-Original-Motion-Picture-Soundtrack/dp/B000004286/sr=8-1/qid=1165590369/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-5960899-5574333?ie=UTF8&s=music theme to Mel Gibson's ''Braveheart'' (see samples for tracks 2-4)].

====[[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]]====
Turgon is very tall and proud, grave of face; reflective and wise. Like his people, his garments are simple, though fine. He is often found in silver-gray or white, and his silver crown contains large red garnets. In great ceremonies he wears red and white, embroidered with gold, carrying a staff carved of white wood, with a gull carved on the end.

His leitmotif is very sturdy and regal. It relies much upon brass, perhaps French Horns or trumpets, playing slowly and solemnly. It also has a distinct tinge of sadness or wistfulness.

Idea leitmotif (3/4): E, ''+A'', +B, ''+C'', -A/+B, +C, +D. /-C, -B, -G, -D, ''+E'', +F#, ''+G'', +A/-G, -F#. /-E, -D, ''+E''

====[[Voronwë of Gondolin|Voronwë]]====

In the beginning Voronwë is dressed in simple gray; a loose tunic and brown belt. Later he wears blue and silver, but always somewhat simply, without jewelry and always loosely.

Voronwë's leitmotif is played ideally on pipes or harps, like the Sea theme but lower. It is wild and quiet, somewhat simple as well, with a tinge of wistfulness.

====[[Ulmo]]====

Ulmo appears as he is described, very strong, in shining mail. Despite his even bearing, he has a bit of wildness about him.

His theme, too, is similar to both the Valinor and Sea themes. It is a combination of whistles in a high, churning melody, and low, sweet strings and horns in a slow, regal and beautiful theme.

====Lords of Gondolin====

[[Glorfindel]] is light-hearted, but very powerful and fiery. [[Ecthelion of the Fountain|Ecthelion]] is more stoic, with quiet emotion and a cold but steady sword-arm. [[Rog]] is misshapen, and it is suggested that he was once tortured by Morgoth; he has a fierce hate of evil, and a love of his art of smithing. All others feature only as minor: [[Egalmoth]] and [[Galdor of the Tree|Galdor]] appear several times with speaking roles, [[Penlod]], [[Duilin of Gondolin|Duilin]], and possibly [[Salgant]] are relegated to a non-speaking (except possibly for several short phrases) background role.

Glorfindel's leitmotif would be played on the woodwinds; high and noble, but seeming never to be still, always active. Ecthelion's is more horns and flutes, a regal, tuneful theme with a tinge of sadness and solemnity. Rog's is deep, with drums and a suggestion of darkness and great anger.

:Rog leitmotif idea (bass clef): A, +C, -Bb, +E, -D, +E, -C, +D#, -A, +B
:Glorfindel leitmotif idea (upper clef, high register; steady A below): E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/-E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/+E/-C/-A/-E/E/+A, C

====[[Maeglin]]====

Maeglin is generally dressed in black embroidered with silver, never excessively ornamented. He should be handsome and dark-haired, but with a somewhat rough voice.

His leitmotif can be played either quick or slow depending on the situation. It is, in its way, beautiful; played either minor or major, with occasional twists and surprise movements, but steady. Possible instruments would be strings or woodwinds.

====Inhabitants of [[Gondolin]]====
In Gondolin it is accepted that weapons are not generally openly displayed, except for guards on duty or during special ceremonies. Men wear Roman-like tunics, but often longer and more robe-like. Women typically have long dresses similar to those in fashion in Medieval Europe in the 14th century, but looser and lighter of material. In ceremonies of importance both their robes are still simple (no elaborate layers decked with gems or anything like that), but embroidered with gold, silver, and other colors. Soldiers wear surcoats bearing the emblem of their house, beneath which is fish-scale mail.

===Places===
====[[Dor-Lómin]]====

Scandinavia.

====[[Gondolin]]====
Idea leitmotif (4/4): A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/-D, +F, -E, A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/+G, -F#, -D

=====[[Square of the King]]=====

A four-sided area on a raised portion near the center of the City of Gondolin. On the far side is the great white palace of King Turgon, with the high tower spiraling up from its center. On either side of the bronze doors of the palace is a tree, one of gold and one of silver ([[Glingal]] and [[Belthil]]). The space of their branches is great enough that a score of elves could sit in each of their boughs, and they are filled with many singing white birds. In the middle of the courtyard, however, is the main attraction: a great fountain, formed by a natural geyser coming from the earth. It shoots up twenty-seven fathoms in the air, seeming to be made of crystal rain. The courtyard is bordered by a low wall of white stone, from which one could look out on the whole city, and just inside the walls by many beautiful green trees, though far smaller in stature than Glingal and Belthil.

=====[[Square of the Folkwell]] (Gardens)=====

A place of light and beauty. The ground is laid by smooth white stone like marble, and great trees grow about them. The roots of the trees are planted each in a raised area of green, grassy earth, which are close enough together that the sunlight comes down in shafts through the branches. Each of the circles is about fourteen cubits in diameter. Some of the mallorns have buildings in their high bows. The trees form a sort of ring around the Folkwell, which is fully two fathoms across and nine fathoms deep clear. It is fed by a spring down at the bottom, and the excess water is piped off to feed the trees of the Square.

=====Hall of the Chronicle=====

Not found in Tolkien's works. The hall is long and white, with a high ceiling. Windows are found just below the ceiling, on a clerestory. The paintings of the history are unbroken, one painting shifting into the other, in bright colors of blue, red, gold, silver, etc., very much in the romantic style.

=====[[Gar Ainion]]=====

A place, again, of light and beauty, with an ephasis on gold, white, and green. It is regular in shape, with arches leaving it open to the winds. Trees grow around it, especially mallorns. Its stone is white and laced with vines, inlaid with intricate gold engravings of leaves and scenes of hunts and bliss in Valinor.

====[[Firth of Drengist]]====
Ideal filming locations would be Cathedral Caves in New Zealand or Cape Cove in Oregon. Both are very different, so it's one or the other. The description in ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]'' is of trees, white sands, and great cliffs beset with caverns and spoutholes.

====[[Vinyamar]]====

==References==
*[[The Fall of Gondolin]], [[Book of Lost Tales 2]]
*[[The Silmarillion]]
*[[Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin]]
__NOTOC__

User:Maeglin

2008-05-01T00:30:20Z

Maeglin:

User talk:Amroth/Screenplays/Fall of Gondolin

2008-04-30T02:44:20Z

Maeglin: /* General Discussion */

Greetings! This is the screenplay for Tolkien's epic story, ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]''. The title "''Fall of Gondolin''" may or may not be kept. We may start the script either with [[Tuor]], or with [[Turgon]]'s building of [[Gondolin]], or with a certain "fictional" character who sees Turgon. Unlike the [[Lay of Leithian]] or the [[Narn i Chîn Húrin]], it is possible to insert a "fictional" character, that is one the writers made up, to put the story into more "story-like" form. The other option would be to center on Tuor himself.

As far as my own ideas for the general style of the production go, I believe this production would do well with a sort of poetic style. That is, a heavy emphasis on music and landscape, for instance. Also, the world will be revealed through Tuor's eyes; we see Gondolin for the first time at the same time he does, for instance. Discuss this screenplay below, and feel free to challenge anything if you see fit. --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]]

==General Discussion==
General discussion below this line.

== Maeglin subplot ==

Would it be worth it to add a minor subplot concerning Maeglin's upbringing? It would probably only be a few minutes and could intertwine with Tuor's youth, perhaps. Does that sound reasonable or am I just being irrational because I like Maeglin(thus my username)? At any rate I think it would be worth mentioning his past in order to set up his role.--[[User:Maeglin|Maeglin]] 22:44, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

===Galdor's name===

Should we change Galdor's name? Because of how early in the legendarium he appears I should think it to be forgivable. The point is that I don't want people confusing Tuor's grandfather with this elf-lord (nor do I think Tolkien would, if he had ever rewritten the tale). In one scene I wrote Tuor as saying, "I am Tuor, son of Huor, son of Galdor, son of Hador." Galdor the elf-lord is a minor character, but he does appear at least once by name. A simple solution would be to just have Tuor say, "I am Tuor son of Huor, descendant of Hador." Or, we could change Galdor's name to something else (or even replace Galdor's role altogether with an "invented" character). What are your opinions? --[[User:Narfil Palùrfalas|Narfil Palùrfalas]] 11:27, 21 December 2007 (EST)

:I kind of like the idea of just not mentioning his name, it doesn't confuse people and yet it doesn't go against what Tolkien wrote. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 12:04, 21 December 2007 (EST)

===Title Ideas===

* The White Citadel
* Gondolin

==Questions/suggestions/comments==

===Scenes===

Synopsises below. You may add on ideas as you wish, directly after the synopsises under their own heading.

====One====
The prologue scene; in this scene, [[Ulmo]] will do a voiceover as [[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]] places the armor in [[Vinyamar]]. Ulmo should introduce Turgon's calling to Gondolin, and the promise of a messenger to herald the end. Turgon's face should be hidden during the entirety of this scene, either hooded or merely not shown directly.

====Two====
In this scene [[Tuor]] should escape from the [[Easterlings]], introducing his lineage and the position of [[Men]].

====Three====
Here Tuor heads west, coming to [[Belegaer]]. He will eventually be whispered-to by a gull, a sort of messenger from Ulmo, and head south to Vinyamar. There he enters and discovers the armor, putting it on.

====Four====
In this scene Tuor exits Vinyamar to stand on the sands in front. As he does so, he spies storm-clouds westward over the sea, and hears thunder. Ulmo appears in all his majesty, with his horns calling, and charges him with a mission.

====Five====

==Conceptual Design==
Below shall be discussion for Conceptual Design, and below the discussion conceptual drawings.

Leitmotif code: Each normal letter signifies a quarter note, with ","s to seperate them into beats. "+" or "-" are added to show whether the following note is the one above or below it; a double of either of these shows that it is that note plus and octave. If there is a "/" between two regular notes, that shows both notes to be eighth-notes; double "/" shows them to be sixteenth, and so on. Half-notes are denoted when italicized, and whole notes when boldened. A connecting slur is denoted by "_", while a dot is ".". See below the example:

"Mary had a little lamb": E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, ''E'', -D, D, ''D'', +E, +G, ''G'', -E, -D, -C, +D, +E, E, E, E, -D, D, +E, -D, '''-C'''.

===Persons===
====[[Tuor]]====
Tuor should be a rough-looking sort of man to begin with, but at the same time tall and lordly. Rather like the description of [[Aragorn II|Aragorn]], yet not quite so rugged and "in-tune" with the wild. He should always show a certain cleanliness, even when in the wilderness. After he enters Gondolin, he should be always dressed simply, generally in white and blue.

His leitmotif is somewhat wild and free, a little rustic, but tuneful. It also has a solid, low subtone that suggests nobility or royalty. Ideal instruments would be violin, harp, and/or whistle.

====[[Idril]]====
Idril generally wears, like her father, white and red, though occasionally blue and silver can be found in her outfits. Her hair is long and golden, reaching below her waist, often crowned with golden leaves or with a braid.

Idril's leitmotif is high but soft, probably in flutes, whistles, and/or a solo singer. It is probably the most romantic theme, yet not overly so. It remains soft and simple, without being rich and reinforced by a host of other instruments. Best compared to the [http://www.amazon.com/Braveheart-Original-Motion-Picture-Soundtrack/dp/B000004286/sr=8-1/qid=1165590369/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-5960899-5574333?ie=UTF8&s=music theme to Mel Gibson's ''Braveheart'' (see samples for tracks 2-4)].

====[[Turgon the Wise|Turgon]]====
Turgon is very tall and proud, grave of face; reflective and wise. Like his people, his garments are simple, though fine. He is often found in silver-gray or white, and his silver crown contains large red garnets. In great ceremonies he wears red and white, embroidered with gold, carrying a staff carved of white wood, with a gull carved on the end.

His leitmotif is very sturdy and regal. It relies much upon brass, perhaps French Horns or trumpets, playing slowly and solemnly. It also has a distinct tinge of sadness or wistfulness.

Idea leitmotif (3/4): E, ''+A'', +B, ''+C'', -A/+B, +C, +D. /-C, -B, -G, -D, ''+E'', +F#, ''+G'', +A/-G, -F#. /-E, -D, ''+E''

====[[Voronwë of Gondolin|Voronwë]]====

In the beginning Voronwë is dressed in simple gray; a loose tunic and brown belt. Later he wears blue and silver, but always somewhat simply, without jewelry and always loosely.

Voronwë's leitmotif is played ideally on pipes or harps, like the Sea theme but lower. It is wild and quiet, somewhat simple as well, with a tinge of wistfulness.

====[[Ulmo]]====

Ulmo appears as he is described, very strong, in shining mail. Despite his even bearing, he has a bit of wildness about him.

His theme, too, is similar to both the Valinor and Sea themes. It is a combination of whistles in a high, churning melody, and low, sweet strings and horns in a slow, regal and beautiful theme.

====Lords of Gondolin====

[[Glorfindel]] is light-hearted, but very powerful and fiery. [[Ecthelion of the Fountain|Ecthelion]] is more stoic, with quiet emotion and a cold but steady sword-arm. [[Rog]] is misshapen, and it is suggested that he was once tortured by Morgoth; he has a fierce hate of evil, and a love of his art of smithing. All others feature only as minor: [[Egalmoth]] and [[Galdor of the Tree|Galdor]] appear several times with speaking roles, [[Penlod]], [[Duilin of Gondolin|Duilin]], and possibly [[Salgant]] are relegated to a non-speaking (except possibly for several short phrases) background role.

Glorfindel's leitmotif would be played on the woodwinds; high and noble, but seeming never to be still, always active. Ecthelion's is more horns and flutes, a regal, tuneful theme with a tinge of sadness and solemnity. Rog's is deep, with drums and a suggestion of darkness and great anger.

:Rog leitmotif idea (bass clef): A, +C, -Bb, +E, -D, +E, -C, +D#, -A, +B
:Glorfindel leitmotif idea (upper clef, high register; steady A below): E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/-E/+A/-G/+A/+D/-C/+D/-C/+E/-C/-A/-E/E/+A, C

====[[Maeglin]]====

Maeglin is generally dressed in black embroidered with silver, never excessively ornamented. He should be handsome and dark-haired, but with a somewhat rough voice.

His leitmotif can be played either quick or slow depending on the situation. It is, in its way, beautiful; played either minor or major, with occasional twists and surprise movements, but steady. Possible instruments would be strings or woodwinds.

====Inhabitants of [[Gondolin]]====
In Gondolin it is accepted that weapons are not generally openly displayed, except for guards on duty or during special ceremonies. Men wear Roman-like tunics, but often longer and more robe-like. Women typically have long dresses similar to those in fashion in Medieval Europe in the 14th century, but looser and lighter of material. In ceremonies of importance both their robes are still simple (no elaborate layers decked with gems or anything like that), but embroidered with gold, silver, and other colors. Soldiers wear surcoats bearing the emblem of their house, beneath which is fish-scale mail.

===Places===
====[[Dor-Lómin]]====

Scandinavia.

====[[Gondolin]]====
Idea leitmotif (4/4): A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/-D, +F, -E, A, A, +E, E, -D, +E/+G, -F#, -D

=====[[Square of the King]]=====

A four-sided area on a raised portion near the center of the City of Gondolin. On the far side is the great white palace of King Turgon, with the high tower spiraling up from its center. On either side of the bronze doors of the palace is a tree, one of gold and one of silver ([[Glingal]] and [[Belthil]]). The space of their branches is great enough that a score of elves could sit in each of their boughs, and they are filled with many singing white birds. In the middle of the courtyard, however, is the main attraction: a great fountain, formed by a natural geyser coming from the earth. It shoots up twenty-seven fathoms in the air, seeming to be made of crystal rain. The courtyard is bordered by a low wall of white stone, from which one could look out on the whole city, and just inside the walls by many beautiful green trees, though far smaller in stature than Glingal and Belthil.

=====[[Square of the Folkwell]] (Gardens)=====

A place of light and beauty. The ground is laid by smooth white stone like marble, and great trees grow about them. The roots of the trees are planted each in a raised area of green, grassy earth, which are close enough together that the sunlight comes down in shafts through the branches. Each of the circles is about fourteen cubits in diameter. Some of the mallorns have buildings in their high bows. The trees form a sort of ring around the Folkwell, which is fully two fathoms across and nine fathoms deep clear. It is fed by a spring down at the bottom, and the excess water is piped off to feed the trees of the Square.

=====Hall of the Chronicle=====

Not found in Tolkien's works. The hall is long and white, with a high ceiling. Windows are found just below the ceiling, on a clerestory. The paintings of the history are unbroken, one painting shifting into the other, in bright colors of blue, red, gold, silver, etc., very much in the romantic style.

=====[[Gar Ainion]]=====

A place, again, of light and beauty, with an ephasis on gold, white, and green. It is regular in shape, with arches leaving it open to the winds. Trees grow around it, especially mallorns. Its stone is white and laced with vines, inlaid with intricate gold engravings of leaves and scenes of hunts and bliss in Valinor.

====[[Firth of Drengist]]====
Ideal filming locations would be Cathedral Caves in New Zealand or Cape Cove in Oregon. Both are very different, so it's one or the other. The description in ''[[The Fall of Gondolin]]'' is of trees, white sands, and great cliffs beset with caverns and spoutholes.

====[[Vinyamar]]====

==References==
*[[The Fall of Gondolin]], [[Book of Lost Tales 2]]
*[[The Silmarillion]]
*[[Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin]]
__NOTOC__

Forums:Screenplays

2008-04-27T19:50:21Z

Maeglin:

<div style="background: #eee; border: 1px solid #aaa; padding: 5px">'''[[Main Page|Tolkien Gateway]] > [[Forum:Council|Council]] > {{PAGENAME}}'''</div> [[Category:Council]]



Hi!

I am extremely new here and have been trying to figure things out- so sort of an introduction...

I have a question concerning the screenplays section. I think it's a great idea, and I would love to contribute diolouge or at least ideas. But I have only read the Silmarillion, The Lord of the Rings books and the hobbit, (though I've researched a little more...). Do I need the exact wording to contribute to a part in, say ''The Fall of Gondolin'' if I have only read the version provided in the silmarillion? Can I contribute ideas or concepts if I can't provide the exact diolouge?

Forgive me if I have broken any rules or norms, I understand this isn't a typical forum....